Try your very hardest not to be a cun t and you’ll be very easy to work for. I.e. be like Alain. But no. We have all this shit, all the time.
Alain explains why he left
- Thread starter TheSmiths_1985
- Start date
Try your very hardest not to be a cun t and you’ll be very easy to work for. I.e. be like Alain. But no. We have all this shit, all the time.
If he knew how to manage anything we wouldn’t have two unreleased albums and “F*CK HARVEST” t-shirts leaving that record in limbo.
First reported in the Boogaloo Radio / Mixcloud: Alain Whyte interview with lots of Moz mentions (January 7, 2020) article, it looks like Morrissey was the one who decided to re-connect with Alain. A lot of people have assumed that Alain's Safe-at-Home sessions in 2020 resulted in him getting the job again, but it looks like they were already talking well before that:
Alain: "I speak quite often with Spencer and Gary on the phone. We catch up with Boz a little bit as well."
Julie: "Have you heard from Morrissey recently?"
Alain: "I received really nice e-mails around four or five months ago [September or August 2019]. I told him I just released The Experiment EP and did a video. Moz wrote back, "Can I see the video?" I sent him a link to the video and he replied, "Wow. You must be proud. Your voice sounds really good. You still look the same."
hand in glove
Well-Known Member
Morrissey comes first in Morrissey’s world. It’s always been that way. In the past he had good managers who did their job. He got along with them well enough that they could work with him. Morrissey’s mother, I feel, was instrumental in guiding Morrissey, too, and she would have been the only person he truly trusted. Now, though, he seems to have a friend managing him instead, and that’s just no good. All Mr MarfaGiant will do is say yes to Morrissey and skip away. So, nobody’s doing anything to actually help him. To actually get him where he needs to be and who will do their best to keep him in check, so to speak. He is notoriously difficult to work with and not many people want to deal with that these days, so Morrissey is trying to do it all himself because there isn’t anyone he trusts enough to compromise with and there isn’t a record company in the world who’s going to give him everything he wants.
I guess I mean the lineup changes could be challenging for release, for self or otherwise, but particularly for self in this way: putting up the recorded album (and wanting to generate excitement over songwriting quality etc. would seem to me to ideally entail some promotion or recognition of the instrumentalists on the record. And at least to me, it could be a little bit of record scratch promoting the thing and its virtues without its main songwriting pair present, enthusiastic, and touring.
I think it makes the promotion cycle little weird and could raise some questions and eyebrows
I don't think there are necessarily structural or legal barriers preventing the self-release or corporate release of an album, but it does seem a little stickier this time around (given the departures) the last time. Bonfire dodges this predicament as a kind of interesting one-off project will be into existence during the pandemic with a fascinating lineup of musicians some of whom have never and may never appear in a Morrissey album again.
And while yes, Alain is very clear that his issues are with the manager and not Morrissey himself, I think there's also a little bit of the history of managers catching the blame of decisions and directions that come at the behest of Morrissey himself. That lack of management and the use of the manager as a go-between is I think fairly well established in the chronicles of the Smiths' Histoty the clashes between Morrissey and Marr over management lack of management and the pressure on Marr felt om himself to sort of keep things running
You are of course correct that Gustavo and Alain could always work with Morrissey again, those two fellas forming their own band with other members from previous solo incarnations I think makes further reconciliation a little bit far-fetched. I'm not ruling out the possibility but teaming up to go off and do your own thing together with all of these other castaways is kind of a bold statement and could very well be interpreted as one-upmanship were somewhat confrontational – though it's not necessarily that. It feels different than Moz reaching out to congratulate a one-time band member and co-writer about his own solo work. I could be wrong, but that's what I'm thinking what
Crisstti
Well-Known Member
OK I see your point.
I don’t really think it would be a problem however, because Moz’s band members and songwriting partners have really never gotten much public recognition and most people wouldn’t even know who they are.
The press has been very lazy in this respect. And you could say maybe Moz could do more to promote them, but in the end he is a solo artist…
Yeah Moz has a tricky history with managerial types for sure. This Donnie guy he seems to get along with though, rightly or wrongly.
It does seem, from what Alain said, that the problem was about form, about the way he spoke to and treated band members, rather than about any direction coming from him.
One would think so, but Alain already had his band of former Moz associates and it didn’t seem to be a problem with Morrissey.
J
JessieSuXrealBad
Guest
When is Alain coming back?
Moz desperately needs a real lead guitar player or even a "real" guitar in general.
It is real sad hearing his classic songs butchered by mediocre "chug rock" power chord down stroke strumming.
Moz desperately needs a real lead guitar player or even a "real" guitar in general.
It is real sad hearing his classic songs butchered by mediocre "chug rock" power chord down stroke strumming.
SuedeMoz
Well-Known Member
I doubt he's coming back, probably the best we can hope for is that he continues to write songs for Morrissey (and maybe someday we'll get to hear them). In my opinion, the band with Alain back was the best it's been in years.
Well yes they've never really gotten recognition, but especially if you're doing a self-release (which I don't think Morrissey will ever do) or if you're just trying to drum up label interest by highlighting the talents contributions etc. ofyour of your songwriters seems like it could be a way to go. And because of the situation here, perhaps the best option is to talk about your current band and the songwriting process. If his co-writers have never gotten publicity and most people would not know who they are (which is true) why not change that?
Mo could absolutely promote the band and the music more. Yes, he is a solo artist. but he needs the musicians (even if those are studio musicians or a rotating cast of songwriters as much as they need him. He's not out here making songs with artificial intelligence software yet. He's not writing books. He is not doing spoken word poetry. He is not capable, as currently construed, of producing music entirely on his own, and it's past time that his songwriters and bandmates are focused on more. If the media won't do it, then for the sake of the art that he wants to release to the world so much, he should do it. It seems plausible to me (given the sentiments expressed in the autobiography )that this issue of band member promotion credit or whatever could be at work here and that might be part of the factors at play in terms of the manager's treatment of band members
I was rather shocked during the California Son album cycle that both Jesse and Roger Manning JR (remember him!? )Were featured in the making of album videos that were put on YouTube along with Buffy St. Marie and some of the other original artists and producers. And Jesse appeared alongside Moz in that rather lengthy behind-the-scenes interview/videos during the Ringleader Album Cycle
So it has been n done and it could be done again. Whether as part of label promotion or a self-release Morrissey (in my view) has to do more meaningfully talking about and "promoting" his next album cycle. And he doesn't need a journalistic partner, anyone asking questions etc. to do it Simply touring posting statements on Central, and claiming in album promotion cycle after album promotion cycle that the current album is the best work you have ever done is not sufficient
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Hilarious! Flaming Turkey balls.
JoeSellMozza
Well-Known Member
Mozzypaws
Well-Known Member
Excellent if soHe seems to be back this fall
Or does he mean his own band?
TheSmiths_1985
Hello, honky tonks 💋
He was referring to his new/old band that he has started with Gary Day, Spencer Cobrin, Craig Gannon and Gustavo Manzur. Assume they’ll be doing some shows soon.He seems to be back this fall
Or does he mean his own band?
J
JessieSuxDic
Guest
40 years later and I'm way more excited about Alain's current band than Moz current touring bad.
MoneyChangesEverything
"Why Don't You Find Out For Yourself?"
Me too. The 1991-1997 era was easily my favorite incarnation of his band.
A
Anonymous
Guest
As much as I love Alain and the other ex-band members, I'd be surprised if they could pull a live audience larger than a small pub.
Phranc & Open
Dreaming from the past
That's enough for me (not the member).
Didn’t Alain haveplans to mark the 30 th anniversary of YA by a tour with his former band mates (except for Boz) + Craig? The setlist covers nearly all songs from YA.He seems to be back this fall
Or does he mean his own band?
I think the project got delayed when Alain was asked to join Morrissey’s band as a replacement for Boz.
But now that he has left the band again, he can resurrect that idea again To honour the 31st anniversary of YA.
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