Low In High School drops from number 5 to 46 in mid week chart

[nicky wire's legs]

But you therefore accept the intellectualism you speak of is not in the creation of the art but in what is projected on to it by others?
That's reasonable but it also means that to disagree with you and imbue beauty in something that doesn't confirm to your maths is an equally valid position.

oh no, art is not mathematical at all! not like beauty. it has it's own logic which is why it need not be beautiful. art holds ideas, sometimes very quietly. which is why the person viewing it must be up to the task. often, in order to understand what you're looking at in a piece of art, you need a lifetime behind you of looking at art, and not for example, listening to taylor swift music. each of these things has their own trajectory: understanding one piece of art will lead to a deeper understanding of other art--it becomes it's own language; listening to taylor swift will lead to a deeper understanding of taylor swift (or miley cyrus...or selena Gomez.... or Justin Bieber).

 

[nicky wire's legs]

you're the one who asked, peterb! we're not rowing are we?!

 

[ZOOM FROM GLOOM]

you're the one who asked, peterb! we're not rowing are we?!

maybe peterb has fat fingers and meant to hit 'insightful' ?

 

[Peterb]

beauty and ugliness sure as hell do have objective realities though. it's for that reason that leonard da vinci was able to calculate on paper the dimensions of the classically beautiful face. if math is objective then beauty is objective, because you can apply to it mathematical principals. of course there are always anomalies: beautiful people with asymmetrical faces, with eyes that are too close together, etc.
beauty is something that appeals to the imagination, but which shouldn't require the imagine in order to see. if you're using your imagination in order to find someone beautiful, fyi, that person aint beautiful.
I think punk is very intellectual because it's working in reaction to what came before it. found art is intellectual because it requires a certain attentiveness of regard for daily life, the imbuing of significance into mundanity, which is always a worthwhile artistic endeavour.
my problem with 12 year olds defining what is art is because 12 years old are notorious sell outs. they'll set out anything to be popular, to be liked, to be pretty, to be cool. they have no notion of the value of anything not advancing them in these directions. until such time as they achieve a sense of self worth not contingent upon what others think of them their opinions and, indeed, whole persons, should be eschewed entirely. of course, as with beauty, there are always anomalies (myself at 12 years old, for instance).

oh no, art is not mathematical at all! not like beauty. it has it's own logic which is why it need not be beautiful. art holds ideas, sometimes very quietly. which is why the person viewing it must be up to the task. often, in order to understand what you're looking at in a piece of art, you need a lifetime behind you of looking at art, and not for example, listening to taylor swift music. each of these things has their own trajectory: understanding one piece of art will lead to a deeper understanding of other art--it becomes it's own language; listening to taylor swift will lead to a deeper understanding of taylor swift (or miley cyrus...or selena Gomez.... or Justin Bieber).

Exactly. You list major pop stars. They get into pop music. Why not. I think some of it is just great.
People, surely can appreciate art in any manner they choose and to any level that feels right.
If you feel that you need, what 10, 20, 30 years experience of hard appreciating that's fine but for you.
I accept your position but your view is so judgemental, you cannot accept mine.
Again, I think you're wrong about children. You're not alone though. Adults often become like Cromwellian puritans when it comes to valuing what children think.

 

[nicky wire's legs]

maybe peterb has fat fingers and meant to hit 'insightful' ?

that's usually what I assume!

 

[nicky wire's legs]

Exactly. You list major pop stars. They get into pop music. Why not. I think some of it is just great.
People, surely can appreciate art in any manner they choose and to any level that feels right.
If you feel that you need, what 10, 20, 30 years experience of hard appreciating that's fine but for you.
I accept your position but your view is so judgemental, you cannot accept mine.
Again, I think you're wrong about children. You're not alone though. Adults often become like Cromwellian puritans when it comes to valuing what children think.

you're allowed to like taylor swift if thats your bag. but why do you have to claim taylor swift as art? does it somehow make you feel better about liking her? I like pop tarts (true story), but I don't eat them and think I've had a gourmet meal.

 

[Peterb]

you're allowed to like taylor swift if thats your bag. but why do you have to claim taylor swift as art? does it somehow make you feel better about liking her? I like pop tarts (true story), but I don't eat them and think I've had a gourmet meal.

That's big of you.
It's not about me Rifke and it's not even about Taylor Swift.
Its about the fact that you and no one else gets to choose what is beautiful, ugly or art.

 

[ZOOM FROM GLOOM]

that's usually what I assume!

I think my stalker/boyfriend DavidK has really REALLY fat fingers!, because he gave me over 200 'dislikes' in just a few days ! I really think he tries very hard to hit 'like' or 'insightful' but it must be his fat fingers that he just can't achieve his goal no matter how many times he tries to show his love for me.

 

[nicky wire's legs]

That's big of you.
It's not about me Rifke and it's not even about Taylor Swift.
Its about the fact that you and no one else gets to choose what is beautiful, ugly or art.

thank you! ive been waiting for that distinction for ages!

 

[Peterb]

thank you! ive been waiting for that distinction for ages!

I've edited it.
It looks wrong.

 

[nicky wire's legs]

I think my stalker/boyfriend DavidK has really REALLY fat fingers!, because he gave me over 200 'dislikes' in just a few days ! I really think he tries very hard to hit 'like' or 'insightful' but it must be his fat fingers that he just can't achieve his goal no matter how many times he tries to show his love for me.

poor davidk! he really loused up his attempts to show his undying admiration for you

 

[Peterb]

thank you! ive been waiting for that distinction for ages!

Well I think edited it.
I meant to say that neither you nor anyone else can ..etc.

 

[nicky wire's legs]

Well I think edited it.
I meant to say that neither you nor anyone else can ..etc.

oh. you gave and you took away

 

[ZOOM FROM GLOOM]

That's big of you.
It's not about me Rifke and it's not even about Taylor Swift.
Its about the fact that you and no one else gets to choose what is beautiful, ugly or art.

'Its about the fact that you and no one else gets to choose what is beautiful, ugly or art.'

Before I go to the park to look at flowers or go to the museum, I come here first and ask rifke what I should look at and what I should avoid. It really makes life so much easier ! thank you rifke !

 

[Peterb]

oh. you gave and you took away

Oh come on.
Would you want to the arbiter of what is art?
Good luck to you matey.
By the way I read a post earlier on here that seemed indicate I gave you a dislike.
I did not.

 

[nicky wire's legs]

'Its about the fact that you and no one else gets to choose what is beautiful, ugly or art.'

Before I go to the park to look at flowers or go to the museum, I come here first and ask rifke what I should look at and what I should avoid. It really makes life so much easier ! thank you rifke !

I should think so! by the way, I hope you remember to include a little Klaus nomi in your day today as that is what I am currently prescribing!

 

[Peterb]

'Its about the fact that you and no one else gets to choose what is beautiful, ugly or art.'

Before I go to the park to look at flowers or go to the museum, I come here first and ask rifke what I should look at and what I should avoid. It really makes life so much easier ! thank you rifke !

You see Rifke? K. Makes my point very succinctly. To what authority should be refer?
If you were in Germany in the 30's there would be a very strong referential point that would exclude a raft creative work (that's since way to put it isn't it?)

 

[nicky wire's legs]

Oh come on.
Would you want to the arbiter of what is art?
Good luck to you matey.
By the way I read a post earlier on here that seemed indicate I gave you a dislike.
I did not.

you gave me an off-topic. to a question YOU asked!! hmph.

but enough about me, now it's time for you! do you really like taylor swift, or are you just sticking up for those who do? what do you like about her? would YOU say that she is art?

 

[ZOOM FROM GLOOM]

You see Rifke? K. Makes my point very succinctly. To what authority should be refer?
If you were in Germany in the 30's there would be a very strong referential point that would exclude a raft creative work (that's since way to put it isn't it?)

my point is... that rifke is right. Once had a partner and showed a picture of this person to rifke, and she said that the nose of this person was not art or beautiful and that our relationship would never work because of the imperfections of this persons face! So of course, I broke up with that person immediately ! Thank you ! rifke !

 

[Peterb]

you gave me an off-topic. to a question YOU asked!! hmph.

but enough about me, now it's time for you! do you really like taylor swift, or are you just sticking up for those who do? what do you like about her? would YOU say that she is art?

Rifke. You are excellent, smart and good natured.
I will answer your questions about the swift creature but right now its bloody late ( UK) and I must introduce myself to the duvet.
Rock and roll Rifke.