Morrissey's Dick Gregory death statement - SER Photography / Facebook

On SER's Facebook

"Dick Gregory, America's last hope, dies, aged 84.
He knew how all aspects of the human condition connect to politics.
He was a man of thought and a man of action, when most of us cannot manage to be just one of either. He worked breathlessly - work, words, deeds. He demanded for all what was snatched by the few. He disturbed the White House, and he was too quick for the American print media. They will be pleased that he now ceases to be amongst us ... as we are left with earth-threatening Trump, who will race into war in search of peace."

Morrissey
20 August 2017
Switzerland.

 

[Anonymous]

There was a rumour for ages that The Muppet Show was supposed to include a black character and after all these years Moz finally found him and had to capture it for history.

I wonder if Moz will surprise us all next and actually find Big Foot.

 

[Calamine Lotion]

In fact, I think it was more or less deliberately said with the hope it would draw attention to this horrible practices.
But in stead of that, all attention was drawn to his subspecies comment, so actually he didn't succeed in that. On the contrary.
He was outraged and made that bloody awful comparison.

Exactly. It was said deliberately to provoke and it sort of worked but the attention it got didn't really help his cause.
Changing the world requires some diplomacy even if you're completely convinced your cause is right. Otherwise you just turn people against you and trivialize the matter. You wind up playing right into the hands of the people whose practices you are trying to change.

 

[Quando quando quando]

Okay, but some people* also choose the side that believes "I like this person's songs so whenever they say something they are criticized for they didn't really mean it."
You'd have to believe Morrissey is really naive, ignorant, and stupid, and that this is his first interview to think that his choice of words was not intentional. He is a master troll and knows how to get attention by saying something controversial. "Subspecies" was either chosen intentionally or not. If not then it's amazing he has made it this far.

The real problem is that Ketamine Sun, in order to make this statement mean what she wants it to, has to restate it with additional words added, and then use a hypothetical opinion (We can't really know what "M" would think about Chinese opera) to back it up.

If it was one statement that would be different but it's one of a number of statements that divide people by skin color, nationality, accent, and so on.

So. some people do look for the worst, it's true. Some people wish he would just make a new record. A good one if possible. And some people refuse to realize the implications of his statements. It is true that empathy for animals is less present in some cultures than others but there are people in every conceivable category that you might consider "a subspecies" except for the fact that the term implies some sort of genetic division, and sounds like racism.
Which had to be exactly what he wanted it to sound like so he could get more headlines. Now maybe he is sacrificing his public image in order to draw attention to certain kinds of reprehensible actions, and it so, that's fine. You could even say it's noble. But he can't make these outrageous statements and then pretend to be shocked when people find them outrageous, and he can't expect people to wait for some Mozbot to raise their hand and explain what her "really" meant.

*Mozbots

"It is true that empathy for animals is less present in some cultures than others".

WTF
Oh, this sounds so good, so rational, so let's all stop criticising other cultures, and our own cause you can't say he didn't do that too.

Shall I twist your words the same as you do?

"It is true that empathy for humans is less present in some cultures than others."

Let's all stop arguing anything at all so nobody gets offended.
Long live the Brave New World. I can see signs of that coming along and not only in China.

 

[Anonymous]

The photo inspired me to take a selfie with a homeless dude as well.

Although Morrissey sang that he hasn't got a home it's just a song. He's not actually homeless. Like DUH!

 

[Anonymous]

I love dick.

York or Sargent?

 

[Quando quando quando]

Exactly. It was said deliberately to provoke and it sort of worked but the attention it got didn't really help his cause.
Changing the world requires some diplomacy even if you're completely convinced your cause is right. Otherwise you just turn people against you and trivialize the matter. You wind up playing right into the hands of the people whose practices you are trying to change.

I know what you mean but it still bafles me, the reactions to the horrible practices against living dogs and cats that were visible on the internet didn't provoke the same anger towards it compared with the hostile reactions Moz got. I mean it wasn't a hoax, these practices exist until these days, maybe more secretly then before.

 

[Calamine Lotion]

"It is true that empathy for animals is less present in some cultures than others".

WTF
Oh, this sounds so good, so rational, so let's all stop criticising other cultures, and our own cause you can't say he didn't do that too.

Shall I twist your words the same as you do?

"It is true that empathy for humans is less present in some cultures than others."

Let's all stop arguing anything at all so nobody gets offended.
Long live the Brave New World. I can see signs of that coming along and not only in China.

"WTF" I agree. I don't know what you're talking about. I don't have to twist Morrissey's words. The quote is "You can't help but feel that the Chinese are a subspecies."
I'm not twisting that. I'm talking about the implications of "subspecies" and "WTF" again because you said the same thing in your own post.

You can substitute "human" for "animal" if you like. Then tell me the culture that values human life. I am curious. Maybe I can go live there if it's a place on this Earth.

 

[Anonymous]

Prince's death seems quite strange.

A washed out rock star dying from an overdose of drugs. Very suspicious.

 

[Anonymous]

On SER's Facebook

"Dick Gregory, America's last hope, dies, aged 84.
He knew how all aspects of the human condition connect to politics.
He was a man of thought and a man of action, when most of us cannot manage to be just one of either. He worked breathlessly - work, words, deeds. He demanded for all what was snatched by the few. He disturbed the White House, and he was too quick for the American print media. They will be pleased that he now ceases to be amongst us ... as we are left with earth-threatening Trump, who will race into war in search of peace."

Morrissey
20 August 2017
Switzerland.

Kiddies, make sure you eat your steak every day so dont end up like these two crackpots. Veganism kills brain cells.

 

[Calamine Lotion]

I know what you mean but it still bafles me, the reactions to the horrible practices against living dogs and cats that were visible on the internet didn't provoke the same anger towards it compared with the hostile reactions Moz got. I mean it wasn't a hoax, these practices exist until these days, maybe more secretly then before.

Well maybe if he had talked about the practices instead of using racist language to label a nation of over a billion people. Look what he really did in practice. There is a television show that exists that required money and effort from many people to produce. It wasn't something he saw on the Internet. It was on television which probably still has a greater reach, and definitely a greater reach to an audience that might not be aware of these facts. People who don't have computers and Internet access are still likely to have television.
Did he name the show? Did he name the producer or the narrator? Did he talk about a specific practice? No, no, and no. He didn't encourage anyone to watch this show and remember we're talking about probably months, sometimes more, of time by people that you would imagine he might consider as being on the same side. Did he promote their work? No! He made it all about himself and his statement, and made people probably less likely to do another show about practices in China because why should they risk being labeled racist on top of everything else.
It's pretty hard to get people to watch that stuff. People that are eating meat three times a day don't want to hear it. People that don't consume animals try to get others to watch it but don't want to watch it themselves.
I don't want to watch it. I have seen some of it and it's very disturbing. I don't consume animals so I think I can be spared watching them suffer and be tortured.
The point is that he might have thought "this documentary was really effective and I will make a point to mention it by name." Instead he thought "I will make a really controversial statement and draw attention to the facts that I am against eating animals, and that I make culturally insensitive statements from time to time. Perhaps there is someone that isn't aware of these important facts!"

Sometimes these PETA people should shut up. They are very good at irritating people and being divisive but I don't think they are really very persuasive.

The reason they didn't focus on the program is because he didn't use his voice to promote it. You think it was on the Internet and you've probably read about this "subspecies" incident many times. Some random reporter wants a story and the story was "subspecies" not "good effective documentary about Chinese practices."

 

[Vesper Nocturne]

Okay, but some people* also choose the side that believes "I like this person's songs so whenever they say something they are criticized for they didn't really mean it."
You'd have to believe Morrissey is really naive, ignorant, and stupid, and that this is his first interview to think that his choice of words was not intentional. He is a master troll and knows how to get attention by saying something controversial. "Subspecies" was either chosen intentionally or not. If not then it's amazing he has made it this far.
*Mozbots

Lol. Mozzy? Mozzy??! No way Jose, Cala-lily. Now instead of lol-ing to myself like I did before to Blues Brothers Rawhide... Now instead, the song in my head's going "Trollin' Trollin' Trollin'!". I also always like to always think of ABBA's Knowing me, Knowing You, instead as "Trolling Me, Trolling You". I can't even help it, Cala-lily. It's just how they all get stuck in my head these days.

Personally, I don't particularly mind if the Chinese got a special shoutout if it's because, as it happens, a lot of them seem to think it's ok to roast puppies on an open fire and cook them alive on the street into boiling puppy soup. Does that mean that I think all Chinese eat puppies? Or does it mean that I think it's less cruel to do any of the above to chickens? No it does not, and no I do not. This is last paragraph isn't directed at you anyway btw, Cala-lily.

I'm just generally saying I never really saw the big deal to begin with. And further to which, if I care about something, I do something positive towards it. Not gripe about something else. Or somebody else's word choice. Anyway, when my heart was completely ripped out of my chest after I saw neverending images of dogs being hauled off to the doggie-cooking-alive market in China, I did something. When I wanted to do something to help in a tangible way with cats that had been displaced by bombs and by fighting, and who had been completely ravaged and who didn't even have a rock to sleep on anymore where their homes used to stand in Syria, I did, and I actively do, something about that. Does that mean that I think those animals are more deserving of support than those closer to home? No, it doesn't mean that either. I actively do things where I am, as well. What I'm saying however is that a lot of of people's bitching about their own perceived or their desired political correctness in others, isn't really on my radar of importance, - because there are truly important things to me, which are. Those are my priorities, though. A lot of other people's priorities seem to me to be just sitting around doing nothing, while criticizing other people who actually do positive things.

In other words what I actually think, is that a lot of people's moral outrage here at words, would have without a single shred of a doubt, been moral outrage better spent actually outraged at the horrors that go on each and every day. On a multitude of animal rights and of human rights issues. So many that we can all keep taking our pick.

 

[Vesper Nocturne]

No, reckon he can leave Malibu sometime for a nice pasta with marinara sauce dinner and tons of Italian bread with his "son" when Aunt Nancy doesn't feel like cooking.

Well, I mean I crykey-reckon, PHEW!

 

[caramel sea salt]

Lol. Mozzy? Mozzy??! No way Jose, Cala-lily. Now instead of lol-ing to myself like I did before to Blues Brothers Rawhide... Now instead, the song in my head's going "Trollin' Trollin' Trollin'!". I also always like to always think of ABBA's Knowing me, Knowing You, instead as "Trolling Me, Trolling You". I can't even help it, Cala-lily. It's just how they all get stuck in my head these days.

Personally, I don't particularly mind if the Chinese got a special shoutout if it's because, as it happens, a lot of them seem to think it's ok to roast puppies on an open fire and cook them alive on the street into boiling puppy soup. Does that mean that I think all Chinese eat puppies? Or does it mean that I think it's less cruel to do any of the above to chickens? No it does not, and no I do not. This is last paragraph isn't directed at you anyway btw, Cala-lily.

I'm just generally saying I never really saw the big deal to begin with. And further to which, if I care about something, I do something positive towards it. Not gripe about something else. Or somebody else's word choice. Anyway, when my heart was completely ripped out of my chest after I saw neverending images of dogs being hauled off to the doggie-cooking-alive market in China, I did something. When I wanted to do something to help in a tangible way with cats that had been displaced by bombs and by fighting, and who had been completely ravaged and who didn't even have a rock to sleep on anymore where their homes used to stand in Syria, I did, and I actively do, something about that. Does that mean that I think those animals are more deserving of support than those closer to home? No, it doesn't mean that either. I actively do things where I am, as well. What I'm saying however is that a lot of of people's bitching about their own perceived or their desired political correctness in others, isn't really on my radar of importance, - because there are truly important things to me, which are. Those are my priorities, though. A lot of other people's priorities seem to me to be just sitting around doing nothing, while criticizing other people who actually do positive things.

In other words what I actually think, is that a lot of people's moral outrage here at words, would have without a single shred of a doubt, been moral outrage better spent actually outraged at the horrors that go on each and every day. On a multitude of animal rights and of human rights issues. So many that we can all keep taking our pick.

You don’t know how much people here do to support various animal and human rights causes. I can assure you you’re not the only one on here actively helping (but of course you wouldn't be you without being a bit self-congratulatory). In any case, one’s own degree of involvement has nothing to do with Morrissey’s comments. Even if one didn’t help various causes, it doesn’t make the subspecies any less offensive.

Oh, and what has Morrissey actually achieved with his comment other than derision? Here's how you get shit done, without the racist comments: http://www.realitytea.com/2017/05/1...ina-temporarily-bans-yulin-dog-meat-festival/

 

[Quando quando quando]

"WTF" I agree. I don't know what you're talking about. I don't have to twist Morrissey's words. The quote is "You can't help but feel that the Chinese are a subspecies."
I'm not twisting that. I'm talking about the implications of "subspecies" and "WTF" again because you said the same thing in your own post.

You can substitute "human" for "animal" if you like. Then tell me the culture that values human life. I am curious. Maybe I can go live there if it's a place on this Earth.

I should have added you didn't point to the relation there was between his comment and what he saw, in stead of saying twisting his words.
The thing is, he probably knew and knows that if he was making his point in the sensible, argumentive way, you and many others wanted and trying to attract more attention then it had so far (why?) it would not work. As I think he thought.
Now his subspecies comment is seen as so much worser then the horrible atrocities, because hey, it's only anima!s. Not important, the racist comment is. Mind you, I dislike that too.
Television or internet, does it make any difference where he saw it?
In any case, it wasn't a hoax. It was for real.

 

[The Wild Turkey]

Ya gotta be a real cornball to get on here and say something sideways about Dick Gregory.
Mr. Gregory gets nothin' but love and respect from The Wild Turkey.

 

[Anonymous]

Michael Jackson was killed by a laser.

He ! Heee ! Sharrrrrmone Mother 4ckr ! You know wha I'm sayin ? Hugh ! Hugh !

#weRome/BaroneRAffaele

Benny-the-British-Butcher

 

[The Wild Turkey]

He ! Heee ! Sharrrrrmone Mother 4ckr ! You know wha I'm sayin ? Hugh ! Hugh !

#weRome/BaroneRAffaele

Benny-the-British-Butcher

Like I said, a real cornball.

 

[Quando quando quando]

Like I said, a real cornball.

You're so funny Wild Turkey!
I love you.

 

[Calamine Lotion]

Like I said, a real cornball.

Don't tell me! I'll tell you! huh? huh?

 

[Calamine Lotion]

Lol. Mozzy? Mozzy??! No way Jose, Cala-lily. Now instead of lol-ing to myself like I did before to Blues Brothers Rawhide... Now instead, the song in my head's going "Trollin' Trollin' Trollin'!". I also always like to always think of ABBA's Knowing me, Knowing You, instead as "Trolling Me, Trolling You". I can't even help it, Cala-lily. It's just how they all get stuck in my head these days.

Personally, I don't particularly mind if the Chinese got a special shoutout if it's because, as it happens, a lot of them seem to think it's ok to roast puppies on an open fire and cook them alive on the street into boiling puppy soup. Does that mean that I think all Chinese eat puppies? Or does it mean that I think it's less cruel to do any of the above to chickens? No it does not, and no I do not. This is last paragraph isn't directed at you anyway btw, Cala-lily.

I'm just generally saying I never really saw the big deal to begin with. And further to which, if I care about something, I do something positive towards it. Not gripe about something else. Or somebody else's word choice. Anyway, when my heart was completely ripped out of my chest after I saw neverending images of dogs being hauled off to the doggie-cooking-alive market in China, I did something. When I wanted to do something to help in a tangible way with cats that had been displaced by bombs and by fighting, and who had been completely ravaged and who didn't even have a rock to sleep on anymore where their homes used to stand in Syria, I did, and I actively do, something about that. Does that mean that I think those animals are more deserving of support than those closer to home? No, it doesn't mean that either. I actively do things where I am, as well. What I'm saying however is that a lot of of people's bitching about their own perceived or their desired political correctness in others, isn't really on my radar of importance, - because there are truly important things to me, which are. Those are my priorities, though. A lot of other people's priorities seem to me to be just sitting around doing nothing, while criticizing other people who actually do positive things.

In other words what I actually think, is that a lot of people's moral outrage here at words, would have without a single shred of a doubt, been moral outrage better spent actually outraged at the horrors that go on each and every day. On a multitude of animal rights and of human rights issues. So many that we can all keep taking our pick.

You're right that action is better than words. And what's happening to animals in real life is more important than some opinion about some opinion.
It's just that if we are going to talk about what Morrissey says let's not pretend like someone twisted his words.
You give examples of why you feel what he said was justified. That's honest. It's dishonest to rewrite his statement and act like it meant something else. As long as someone says "He said it and meant it and I agree," what can you say?