Tony Visconti says he wouldn't mind working with Morrissey again; not in touch - Irish Times

Tony Visconti: ‘The thing with Phil Lynott was that he was visibly dying’ - The Irish Times
The veteran record producer on Bowie, Morrissey and his problem with Steve Albini

Excerpt:

Morrissey’s great knack
Speaking of Morrissey, Visconti worked on his 2005 album, Ringleader of the Tormentors. Does he intend to work with the prickly Mancunian-Irish singer again? “I wouldn’t mind working with him again, and I’m very proud of the album we did, but we are not in touch,” he says. “I don’t know. He’s off on something else. That’s all I can really say. He has a knack of pushing people away from him. It’s the way he lives his life."

 

[Tom]

Visconti is a great producer, but terrible at actual production. I think his mastering skills over the past 15 years or so are atrocious. Ringleader sounds terrible because of the excessive compression used on the album. There are no dynamics or separation, everything is just "loud." Take a look at the waveform of the first track, it's almost a solid brick with no peaks or valleys. The entire album is like that. If there's ever a need for a remaster, Ringleader needs one desperately, hopefully without Tony in the room. He did the same thing with Bowie's Heathen and Reality, both are overly compressed and sound awful as a result.

 

[Peterb]

Visconti is a great producer, but terrible at actual production. I think his mastering skills over the past 15 years are so are atrocious. Ringleader sounds terrible because of the excessive compression used on the album. There are no dynamics or separation, everything is just "loud." Take a look at the waveform of the first track, it's almost a solid brick with no peaks or valleys. The entire album is like that. If there's ever a need for a remaster, Ringleader needs one desperately, hopefully without Tony in the room. He did the same thing with Bowie's Heathen and Reality, both are overly compressed and sound awful as a result.

That's really interesting Tom. Do have a waveform to compare this one to?

 

[Peppermint]

I tried that once. I don’t recommend it.

Does anyone think there will be another Morrissey album for Visconti to potentially produce? I ask as it seems releasing albums these days is a very good way to lose money, and the cash is now in touring.

Is Morrissey healthy enough for such a gruelling itineraries now, and if he isn’t why bother putting out an album?

I know, it's a bit abrasive.
I can't see it myself, as things stand. In that December video he looked awful - like a man unravelling. It wasn't nice to see. Not just how he looked, but the delusions and paranoia. It's been heading this way for a while but to me it seems like it's spiralling. I can't help thinking BMG must be wondering what they've got themselves into.

 

[Tom]

That's really interesting Tom. Do have a waveform to compare this one to?

Sure, here's track 1 of Vauxhall and I (original release), Now My Heart Is Full. Notice how there's no pattern of compression to make every peak normalized to the same loud value. Compression is a valuable tool in mastering, but it can be overused (as evident on Ringleader). The basic concept of adding compression is to make the music sound louder without increasing its peak amplitude. When you compress the peak (or loudest) signals, it becomes possible to increase the overall gain (or volume) of a signal without over modulating the sound. When light compression is applied, it can sound terrific. However, when it's overdone, you lose dynamic range, instrument separation, and subtle details in the overall mix. This is unfortunately what happened with Ringleader. The vinyl of Ringleader is a small improvement sound-wise (it's not as over-blown), but was unfortunately cut from the same master.

Compression was a big issue in the mid-2000's among audiophiles. A lot of new releases, and re-issues over-used the compression tool. Unfortunately, Ringleader is one of its biggest victims.

 

[Quando quando quando]

I wonder what he means by "he's off on one"... does he mean Moz is on a mission only Moz understands, or does he mean Moz is off his head, or off on another planet, or something else? "That's all I can really say".... why can't he say whatever he likes? He's Tony Visconti.
It's funny how down through the years so many people are afraid or reluctant to say too much about Moz. It reminds me of "He who can not be named" (i.e. Voldemort).

Never mind all the bitching from various people on Facebook, Twitter etcetera. I know Tony Visconti took part in it. Defending his fiancée.

But the fact remains they worked together very well for Ringleader and despite some flaws in the sound quality or the mix there were at least four or five great songs on it and both inspired each other and were inspired by the co-operation. I mean musically and no shortage on ideas.

I think Tony Visconti is a great producer and a very professional one.

You never know what is going to happen and if for whatever reason Moz has a fallout with his producer and gets into serious scheduling problems with a release date of a new album and he hasn’t a quick solution, I wouldn’t be surprised if he called Tony Visconti.

Remember how he stated himself in the side notes of the the re-issued Southpaw Grammar he went sheepishly back to Steve Lillywhite after Brian Eno and Chris Thomas declined?

This is the possible option Tony Visconti keeps open.
He knows these things happen.

By the way, did Moz himself say anything denigrating about Visconti after the so-called fallout?

Only people from camp Moz did, and Kristeen Young and TV defending her more or less, if I am correct so in a way Moz has not ruled out a possible co-operation in the future as he knows just as Visconti they both could need each other.

Did we actually see the words coming from his mouth he would never work again with Tony Visconti?

Moz gets away with everything.

 

[david ingemarsson]

Visconti is a great producer, but terrible at actual production. I think his mastering skills over the past 15 years or so are atrocious. Ringleader sounds terrible because of the excessive compression used on the album. There are no dynamics or separation, everything is just "loud."

Exactly.

I always thought ringleader had a too loud and static sound, but without being able to explain or articulate it better. I think Tom above just explained it to me!

By the way; weren't Oasis first albums loud in the same way?


On another note: I always found that my favourite, Vauxhall and I, has a dull sound, like a wet blanket was thrown over the whole sound picture, the instruments are kind muddled together;

It doesn't sound as crisp or clear as for example You're the quarry, - any reflections on that?

 

[Oh my]

Steve Albini producing Morrissey - now that's something I'd love to hear.

As much as I like Big Black, Rapeman and Shellac... those who state that Morrissey has become a Karaoke singer after the Smiths are not completely wrong. He is a singer with a supporting band.
Albini would record a band that for an unknown reason has a singer and cover the who thing with a wall of guitars and explosive drums.

I don't think it would be nice to listen to a Morrissey album sounding like The Jesus Lizard... and I actually like Steve Albini!

 

[Charlie Cheswick]

Visconti is a great producer, but terrible at actual production. I think his mastering skills over the past 15 years or so are atrocious. Ringleader sounds terrible because of the excessive compression used on the album. There are no dynamics or separation, everything is just "loud." Take a look at the waveform of the first track, it's almost a solid brick with no peaks or valleys. The entire album is like that. If there's ever a need for a remaster, Ringleader needs one desperately, hopefully without Tony in the room. He did the same thing with Bowie's Heathen and Reality, both are overly compressed and sound awful as a result.

It was mastered by Doug Shearer and Emily Lazar. Don't know if it's those or all three that went with the choice of loud for production though.

 

[NealCassidy]

You will never be

 

[Anonymous]

Yeah, I wonder why that is? Are they hoping maybe to work with him again? Go ahead and dish on Moz ... the worst that's going happen is you'll get frozen out. It's what seems to happen regardless, but at least we'll get some good stories.

nondisclosure agreements.

 

[Tom]

By the way; weren't Oasis first albums loud in the same way?

On another note: I always found that my favourite, Vauxhall and I, has a dull and muted sound, like a wet blanket was thrown over the whole sound picture, the instruments are kind muddled together;

It doesn't sound as crisp or clear as for example You're the quarry, - any reflections on that?

I can't speak to the Oasis albums since I'm not a fan, but there's a very good chance.

Agree on Vauxhall, the original mix of Vauxhall sounds as if it's being played over a loudspeaker with a rag over it. Very dull and muted. The drums on Speedway should be thunderous, as they are live, but they're rather weak on the album. WDYFOFY has so many things going on musically, but everything sounds sort of folded together, it needs more dynamic range. The waveform I used was an example of the overall production (with minimum compression), not a testament to the mix itself. I actually did my own remastering of Vauxhall before the 20th anniversary remaster came out. I based it on an unreleased "remaster" of the album. While the officical remaster addressed some problems, it's still on the dull side. For instance, Billy Budd always needed to be a little louder, and punchier. If you're interested, PM me and I'll send you mine.

Vauxhall is the one album where I wish I had access to the multi-tracks. For example, I'd love to re-work Spring-Heeled Jim. For one, I want a version without the film clips, but two... I'd love a version with more bass presence. The opening bass is terrific, but once the guitars kick in, the bass collapses and gets buried.

 

[Anonymous]

Well I’m pretty sure Steve would produce anyone who hired him.l so who knows. As for tony I don’t think they’ll ever work together again after his siding with young publicly. It’s kinda the same reason he’s probably not expanding now I. E it’s really unprofessional and might cause other people and future clients to think that if they record with him he might spill there business as well. It’s good sense for him to not expand in an article regardless of his wanting to work with morrissey or not. As for ringleader I find it sonically not great and I’m kinda bummed as I think it ruins a good album. I’m not a tech person so I don’t know if it’s production mixing or mastering or what but after a good start with far off places and dear god it starts to sounds overly separated in some places and muddy in others. Mostly not n that section starting with you have killed up until pigsty which I think sounds good

 

[Tom]

It was mastered by Doug Shearer and Emily Lazar. Don't know if it's those or all three that went with the choice of loud for production though.

They might have mastered it, but Victonti has final approval over the mix. It leaves his hands last. I doubt very much Shearer and Lazar were responsible for the over compression of the album, as that's consistent with Visconti's work on other albums. It's pretty much his trademark at this point. Take a look at the opening track from Bowie's Reality, also produced by Visconti, very similar to the compression on Ringleader. It's a pattern on everything he's produced in the past 15 years, even the recent Bowie re-issues, sadly.

I'd love to hear an uncompressed, or lightly compressed version of Ringleader. I have a feeling the original mix would sound light years better.

 

[Flibberty]

Steve Albini producing Morrissey - now that's something I'd love to hear.

I can recommend Visconti's autobiography, probably one of the best rock books I've read in a long time. Not a big fan of everything he's done but he tells a good story and it was interesting to read.

I fully agree with both comments.

 

[Anonymous]

The mastering on Ringleaders is atrocious. The worst on any CD I can name. But it's beyond just bad. Somebody messed up. As noted above, though, it wasn't Visconti, unless he sent a note saying "please take my perfectly fine master tape and make it sound like shit".

 

[Anonymous]

It wouldn’t be so odd to see Albini work with morrissey. He’s worked with Joanna newsome and Jarvis Crocker before

 

[Peterb]

Sure, here's track 1 of Vauxhall and I (original release), Now My Heart Is Full. Notice how there's no pattern of compression to make every peak normalized to the same loud value. Compression is a valuable tool in mastering, but it can be overused (as evident on Ringleader). The basic concept of adding compression is to make the music sound louder without increasing its peak amplitude. When you compress the peak (or loudest) signals, it becomes possible to increase the overall gain (or volume) of a signal without over modulating the sound. When light compression is applied, it can sound terrific. However, when it's overdone, you lose dynamic range, instrument separation, and subtle details in the overall mix. This is unfortunately what happened with Ringleader. The vinyl of Ringleader is a small improvement sound-wise (it's not as over-blown), but was unfortunately cut from the same master.

Compression was a big issue in the mid-2000's among audiophiles. A lot of new releases, and re-issues over-used the compression tool. Unfortunately, Ringleader is one of its biggest victims.

Yeah I can see what you mean.
Thanks for that Tom.

 

[Anonymous]

I think Morrissey cuts people out of his life that are assholes. Given what Morrissey and Kristeen had said about him,there really is no way back from those comments. There are plenty of producers around Tony. I would also like to point out that I am positive Morrissey and Kristeen have some bad habits that Morrissey has never mentioned in public.

 

[Multi]

I've also read a few rumors over the years that Alain Whyte, who played guitars at the sessions, was reportedly upset at the finished mix of the album. Was the original plan for Alain to be a bit more upfront in the mix? His guitars are barely audible on Ringleader since the mixing is very heavily biased towards Jesse. Don't know the whole story about that one.

Yes and it all stems from the Moz loves Jesse over Alain dynamic of the Quarry tour to Refusal firing.

 

[Anonymous]

I tried that once. I don’t recommend it.

Does anyone think there will be another Morrissey album for Visconti to potentially produce? I ask as it seems releasing albums these days is a very good way to lose money, and the cash is now in touring.

Is Morrissey healthy enough for such a gruelling itineraries now, and if he isn’t why bother putting out an album?

she makes Skinny look like a simple peasant from back in the day of Cnute, REALLY NUTTY>
btw, if you want to partake I think she is doing a residency at some Foo Bar in West Hollywood. No
cover.