Quarry vs Maladjusted...couple thoughts---

G

giant

Guest
There is "something" missing when I hear Quarry and and acompanning B-sides (not 100% of the stuff, Im talking generally and as a whole overview)

Maladjusted is still more of an individual then Quarry, though not as polished.

If I had to say one thing, that stands out as a turn off, then it seems Quarry is contrived. More product than power.

Of course, there is only one Moz, and only one with his poison pen but knowing this, makes Quarry weaker in my eyes. Because, Its even "predictable" and that is not a way you could ever describe any of his previous albums be them solo or Smiths works.

he always hit me with the unexpected previously, lyrically, vocally, musically even...but Quarry is really a "generic" Morrissey album.

Anyone care to discuss?




http://www.charlus.org
 
I see what you are saying, it's sort of like by going 'commercial' he's lost some of his 'individual' bite, 'trouble loves me' & 'I can have both' are still on my all time favourites list, I feel it's a shame he doesn't do them still. I love Quarry though & I think it's got quite an American edge to it due to the fact he's spent so much time there, Maladjusted still has the English quaintness.
Bless, well that's my take on it anyhoo.

Grim

> There is "something" missing when I hear Quarry and and
> acompanning B-sides (not 100% of the stuff, Im talking generally and as a
> whole overview)

> Maladjusted is still more of an individual then Quarry, though not as
> polished.

> If I had to say one thing, that stands out as a turn off, then it seems
> Quarry is contrived. More product than power.

> Of course, there is only one Moz, and only one with his poison pen but
> knowing this, makes Quarry weaker in my eyes. Because, Its even
> "predictable" and that is not a way you could ever describe any
> of his previous albums be them solo or Smiths works.

> he always hit me with the unexpected previously, lyrically, vocally,
> musically even...but Quarry is really a "generic" Morrissey
> album.

> Anyone care to discuss?
 
> There is "something" missing when I hear Quarry and and
> acompanning B-sides (not 100% of the stuff, Im talking generally and as a
> whole overview)

> Maladjusted is still more of an individual then Quarry, though not as
> polished.

> If I had to say one thing, that stands out as a turn off, then it seems
> Quarry is contrived. More product than power.

> Of course, there is only one Moz, and only one with his poison pen but
> knowing this, makes Quarry weaker in my eyes. Because, Its even
> "predictable" and that is not a way you could ever describe any
> of his previous albums be them solo or Smiths works.

> he always hit me with the unexpected previously, lyrically, vocally,
> musically even...but Quarry is really a "generic" Morrissey
> album.

> Anyone care to discuss?
giant, but what about "quarry" vs. vauxhall?? I still have a difficult tieme with that one. I love Vauxhall dearly.
 
> giant, but what about "quarry" vs. vauxhall?? I still have a
> difficult tieme with that one. I love Vauxhall dearly.

It's hard to say where "Quarry" will fall over the long haul, ya know?

"Vauxhall & I" has been my favorite Morrissey album for many years now and I don't think "Quarry" is quite as good. There's a dreamy feel to "Vauxhall" that I love. "Quarry", for me, seems to be settling in somewhere in the middle. Which still makes it a top album!

A couple of the "Quarry" b-sides are sub-par, however.

The question for me has always been, is "Vauxhall & I" at the same level as "Meat Is Murder," my favorite Smiths album? I go back and forth on that so much, I've decided to call it a tie.
 
> There is "something" missing when I hear Quarry and and
> acompanning B-sides (not 100% of the stuff, Im talking generally and as a
> whole overview)

> Maladjusted is still more of an individual then Quarry, though not as
> polished.

> If I had to say one thing, that stands out as a turn off, then it seems
> Quarry is contrived. More product than power.

> Of course, there is only one Moz, and only one with his poison pen but
> knowing this, makes Quarry weaker in my eyes. Because, Its even
> "predictable" and that is not a way you could ever describe any
> of his previous albums be them solo or Smiths works.

> he always hit me with the unexpected previously, lyrically, vocally,
> musically even...but Quarry is really a "generic" Morrissey
> album.

> Anyone care to discuss?

I think Quarry is a good album as a whole. But as time passes, I feel less drawn to the individual tracks, then I used to. None of the songs speak to me personally, like so many of his his earlier solo and Smiths songs do.

But without the release of Quarry, I wouldn't have found this Morrissey community.

And of course, I am very happy for its commercial success. Moz deserves it.

I am still a Smiths fan first. But, this may be due to my age more than anything.
 
but, 'PapaJack'...

I love Maladjusted except for , 'PJ' that TOTALLY tanked the album. 'Roys Keen' isn't much fun either but the rest of the album is GREAT! Agreed, 'TLM' SHOULD b played live!
 
> There is "something" missing when I hear Quarry and and
> acompanning B-sides (not 100% of the stuff, Im talking generally and as a
> whole overview)

> Maladjusted is still more of an individual then Quarry, though not as
> polished.

> If I had to say one thing, that stands out as a turn off, then it seems
> Quarry is contrived. More product than power.

> Of course, there is only one Moz, and only one with his poison pen but
> knowing this, makes Quarry weaker in my eyes. Because, Its even
> "predictable" and that is not a way you could ever describe any
> of his previous albums be them solo or Smiths works.

> he always hit me with the unexpected previously, lyrically, vocally,
> musically even...but Quarry is really a "generic" Morrissey
> album.

> Anyone care to discuss?

I felt surprised by "You Are the Quarry," so I don't know.....

I'll have to think about what you're saying next time I play it.

I was blown away by "I Have Forgiven Jesus."

I wouldn't call it a predictable piece of "product," though I do sense it was very important to him that it be well-recieved and that influenced the sound.

At the same time, he had more of a sense of purpose than he did with "Maladjusted." Some of the songs on "Maladjusted", and the b-side "Now I Am A Was", seem influenced by a feeling that he just never could be widely accepted, and a sadness that he's now fading away. With "You Are The Quarry" he's standing up tall again, ready to fight the good fight, and more politicized and engaged in the world. The tommy gun and even the name of the label, "Attack", all convey that message too. Remember back in the "Maladjusted" era, Morrissey acted like someone who had retreated deep into his own world.

I do hope Morrissey isn't afraid of going into a more experimental direction after "Southpaw Grammar" was met with so much disapproval.

I remember something Morrissey said about Oasis that was interesting. When Oasis had the whole world listening, waiting with baited breath for their next release, he was so disappointed that their next move was exactly like the previous and they were afraid to do something off the mark at that most perfect opportunity. I hope Morrissey still thinks that way and, now that he has at least some of the world paying attention to his every move again, I hope he throws a real curve ball. I'd almost like another album where, like "Southpaw Grammar", I take it home and freak out, not knowing if I love it or hate it, but then gradually come to embrace it over time. However, I don't necessarily want him to go in that harder rocking direction. I'd actually like perhaps something extremely gentle, maybe even acoustic and folky! Or, maybe some more bizarre stuff in the spirit of "The Teachers Are Afraid of the Pupils." Whatever he does, it'll be more fun if he has us all fighting over whether he's finally gone off the deep end or not!

That why I'd kinda like someone like a John Cale to produce him next. Someone who's all about the art and completely indifferent to what's commercial.
 
> he always hit me with the unexpected previously, lyrically, vocally,
> musically even...but Quarry is really a "generic" Morrissey
> album.

> Anyone care to discuss?

Do you think some of that was influenced by the fact we'd heard two of the singles on "Quarry", and some of the other songs, YEARS before the album came out? In early forms, yeah, but still...kinda steals some of the surprise of an album.
 
I definitely think you have a great point by saying it has an American edge, Grim,

but if you live in America and you have a slightly sensitive ear,

you HATE American music...

hence, my "contrived" theme...

Giant

> I see what you are saying, it's sort of like by going 'commercial' he's
> lost some of his 'individual' bite, 'trouble loves me' & 'I can have
> both' are still on my all time favourites list, I feel it's a shame he
> doesn't do them still. I love Quarry though & I think it's got quite
> an American edge to it due to the fact he's spent so much time there,
> Maladjusted still has the English quaintness.
> Bless, well that's my take on it anyhoo.

> Grim




http://www.charlus.org
 
thats precisely my quandry Colleen,

I am not an "obsessed Smiths fan" looking to recapture the wild power of that time,

I rate Vauxhall as THEE number 1 record in Morrissey's whole career.

So honestly speaking, these new tunes dont "bite" me....

> giant, but what about "quarry" vs. vauxhall?? I still have a
> difficult tieme with that one. I love Vauxhall dearly.
 
> thats precisely my quandry Colleen,

> I am not an "obsessed Smiths fan" looking to recapture the wild
> power of that time,

> I rate Vauxhall as THEE number 1 record in Morrissey's whole career.

> So honestly speaking, these new tunes dont "bite" me....
Giant, I have to agree with you. "Vauxhall" to me just has more substance and is so beautiful. For a long time, my favorite Smiths album was Strangeways, and I think it's still in the top ten. EVERY0NE loved "Quarry" when it first came out; because the excitement was palpable, we'd waited seven whole years, and we were determined to like it at all costs ( this is just my take ). While I do like "Quarry" and it has its moments(F0GTD) (You Know I Couldn't Last) (Come Back To Camden), it just does not have the....substance that "Vauxhall" has. Mozzer did a great job with "Quarry" and thank christ it's no "Malajusted" but my favorite will always be "Vauxhall". Cheers, giant
 
> It's hard to say where "Quarry" will fall over the long haul, ya
> know?

> "Vauxhall & I" has been my favorite Morrissey album for many
> years now and I don't think "Quarry" is quite as good. There's a
> dreamy feel to "Vauxhall" that I love. "Quarry", for
> me, seems to be settling in somewhere in the middle. Which still makes it
> a top album!

> A couple of the "Quarry" b-sides are sub-par, however.

> The question for me has always been, is "Vauxhall & I" at
> the same level as "Meat Is Murder," my favorite Smiths album? I
> go back and forth on that so much, I've decided to call it a tie.
Theo, yes!!! it's a tie for me, as well! That is a difficult choice.
 
Re: but, 'PapaJack'...

> I love Maladjusted except for , 'PJ' that TOTALLY tanked the album. 'Roys
> Keen' isn't much fun either but the rest of the album is GREAT! Agreed,
> 'TLM' SHOULD b played live!
0MG "Papa Jack" is quite literally the absolute worst song Moz has ever penned ( sorry, Mozzer ).
 
does any one have a problem with dial a cliche

I hear that alot of people dislike this song, i think its great lyrically and musically.
 
Re: does any one have a problem with dial a cliche

> I hear that alot of people dislike this song, i think its great lyrically
> and musically.
I don't know, I've always liked it. It's fun to sing along to. "grow up be a man and close your mealy mouth, dial a cliche..."
 
> I felt surprised by "You Are the Quarry," so I don't know.....

> I'll have to think about what you're saying next time I play it.

> I was blown away by "I Have Forgiven Jesus."

> I wouldn't call it a predictable piece of "product," though I do
> sense it was very important to him that it be well-recieved and that
> influenced the sound.

Very astute. I think the album and the force behind it had feeling of "this is Morrissey's last stand". Maladjusted

But all of this is easier to analyse with the hindsight that it was a big success. If YATQ had bombed, it would remain a curiosity piece in the way that Maladjusted has. But there *is* something about the way it was produced that made it the more "engineered" hit that it is. I think the fact that Moz really likes Jerry Finn as a person is an important point not to overlook. He wouldn't have chosen a commercial producer he didn't get along with. Personally I like the Cadillac sound of the album, with all the bells and whistles (or flutes), if for no other reason than it's different than all his previous albums.

And let's not forget that YATQ stands as the finest example of Morrissey's singing ability to date!

Everything you say below is exactly right, too.

> At the same time, he had more of a sense of purpose than he did with
> "Maladjusted." Some of the songs on "Maladjusted", and
> the b-side "Now I Am A Was", seem influenced by a feeling that
> he just never could be widely accepted, and a sadness that he's now fading
> away. With "You Are The Quarry" he's standing up tall again,
> ready to fight the good fight, and more politicized and engaged in the
> world. The tommy gun and even the name of the label, "Attack",
> all convey that message too. Remember back in the "Maladjusted"
> era, Morrissey acted like someone who had retreated deep into his own
> world.

> I do hope Morrissey isn't afraid of going into a more experimental
> direction after "Southpaw Grammar" was met with so much
> disapproval.

> I remember something Morrissey said about Oasis that was interesting. When
> Oasis had the whole world listening, waiting with baited breath for their
> next release, he was so disappointed that their next move was exactly like
> the previous and they were afraid to do something off the mark at that
> most perfect opportunity. I hope Morrissey still thinks that way and, now
> that he has at least some of the world paying attention to his every move
> again, I hope he throws a real curve ball. I'd almost like another album
> where, like "Southpaw Grammar", I take it home and freak out,
> not knowing if I love it or hate it, but then gradually come to embrace it
> over time. However, I don't necessarily want him to go in that harder
> rocking direction. I'd actually like perhaps something extremely gentle,
> maybe even acoustic and folky! Or, maybe some more bizarre stuff in the
> spirit of "The Teachers Are Afraid of the Pupils." Whatever he
> does, it'll be more fun if he has us all fighting over whether he's
> finally gone off the deep end or not!

> That why I'd kinda like someone like a John Cale to produce him next.
> Someone who's all about the art and completely indifferent to what's
> commercial.
 
Re: does any one have a problem with dial a cliche

> I hear that alot of people dislike this song, i think its great lyrically
> and musically.

I hate it. I also hate Ordinary Boys, Lucky Lisp and Yes, I am Blind. For me that was the worst point of Morrissey's career. When he went all twee and whiney. Thank God for Boz and the rest of the band getting him back on course.
 
Re: does any one have a problem with dial a cliche

Horrible song.
 
Re: does any one have a problem with dial a cliche

I'm with Jones. A lot of those Viva Hate and Kill Uncle songs are nothing short of painful. Thank God for Boz and Alain.
 
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