Abortion as art? So Wrong...

[Renia]

I don't know your mother and I don't know you. I don't know anything about what your mother has put you through except what I read on here and what I read on your blog (yes, I've read your blog).

But I have been through similiar situations with my mother. In fact, I recall PMing you to tell you if you wanted to talk anytime to PM me, as I'd been through the same thing. But you never PMed me back. That's fine. The offer's still on the table. But it does make me wonder if you want help or attention.

There's nothing wrong with posting about family troubles here. I do it. It's helped through many a problem, actually. The members have even given me good advice. But you can't substitute the Internet for a life. I realized that sitting in front of a computer wasn't a good way to deal with my problems. Eventually you need to tell people--your family--what's going on.

Your father seems like a good guy. That's great. I envy you. I've never had a father. In the eighteen years I've been on this planet my father has not shown any interest in me. I've never met the guy. He's just not in my life. It's something I've come to accept.

Sometimes you have to give peeps a chance.

I've dealt with the problem concerning my mother the best I can, and it's pretty much over with.

It didn't end the way I particularly wanted it, nor do I think it particularly ended the way SHE wanted.
Either way, I simply stopped caring. Maybe she'll get her life together, maybe she won't. Quite frankly, I just don't care. She's outta my life, so whatever. If she gets her life together, she can find a way to contact me. God knows she done it before when her life ISN'T together.

and I did mean to message back, but I get sidetracked easily, and then I forget, I do it to everyone, even close friends, and family. I'm sorry. (I also do it if I'm writing a blog or something, ending up with me...not posting a blog. haha.)

and I really don't sit infront of the computer all the time. It's a big chunk of my life, sure, but I do go out on occasion. I prolly would've gone out this weekend, but I have no money.

That, and I need to find people I actually like. Right now, I'm stuck with...people...at school, that skip, drink, and smoke. Not people I particularly feel like hanging out with. And really, my school is one of the worst in Chicago.

(Also. They have no idea who The Smiths/Morrisey are! D: )

 

[Buzzetta]

Oh look...... you didn't agree on something




did it put you off your dinner?

It was a bit unsettling. I really cannot explain it in a way. Do you remember the scene in Die Hard 3 where Bruce Willis character is walking down the street with a sign that says "I hate n******" or something to that?

Imagine if an "artist" walked down the street to demonstrate racial tensions and purposely did that to get themselves repeatedly beat up? There are certain things that go into the realm of unnecessary.

An abortion is an intrusive trauma for the body to endure. What mentally stable person repeatedly undergoes intrusive traumas for the entertainment of others?

While every Supreme Court challenge pushes the boundaries on Constitutional interpretation to define or redefine law, this is simply an example of something that someone is doing for the reason of shock value to the physical detriment of themselves.

You tell me that someone had an abortion and I can think about that regarding my personal opinions regarding abortion. This... this "artist" to me makes a mockery to every woman to ever wanted to become pregnant and cannot. It makes a mockery of every woman who ever chose to get an abortion for whatever her personal reasons were.

 

[Buzzetta]

Is this true? In America, no less? Free country?! I thought adults would have to consent to being institutionalized...

They would arrest you and send you to a hospital or rehab place. I know people who have been locked away in asylums for manic depression and drug abuse before.

Correct... a court can determine whether or not you are of sound mind and body to take care of yourself. Look at what recently happened to Brittney Spears as a public example.

 

[Buzzetta]

Certainly not the United States of America! Hippies can stay outta here!

I think you cannot be held indefinitely in a "psychiatric facility" unless you pose a threat to society and have been put there by the courts. If you are an alcoholic there for several DUIs charged with an assault on a police officer and multiple attempts to commit suicide, you might not be there for very long compared to a Schizophrenic murderer. That is just one example.

It does not even have to be a situation as extreme as what you mentioned. One simply needs to threaten and make an attempt on their own life. The reasoning behind it Chica is that if you are mentally unfit then one of the things a mentally unfit person may do is take their own life. If they are mentally unfit then the courts are making sure that the person is not a victim of a mental illness that is beyond their control.

 

[Renia]

On the subject of putting people into mental asylums:
Yes, you -can- be forcibly commited, but it takes quite a lot sometimes.

For instance, a family member of mine has bipolar disorder and is a shizophrenic.
(it runs in the family.) And while, he does sometimes act out and whatnot (he refuses to take his meds.) you HAVE to prove that they are a danger to themselves and others around them. Otherwise, you can't do a whole lot. We've had him committed...three times, and he's been let out all three times. So it can be kinda pointless at times. Because each time, he stopped taking his medication. And I don't think they particularly checked up on him to MAKE sure he was taking his meds.
=| So yeah, that's what I know about all of that. Mental illness runs in my family. and now you know why I'm so cRRRrrraaAAAZzzzy.

 

[nugz]

On the subject of putting people into mental asylums:
Yes, you -can- be forcibly commited, but it takes quite a lot sometimes.

For instance, a family member of mine has bipolar disorder and is a shizophrenic.
(it runs in the family.) And while, he does sometimes act out and whatnot (he refuses to take his meds.) you HAVE to prove that they are a danger to themselves and others around them. Otherwise, you can't do a whole lot. We've had him committed...three times, and he's been let out all three times. So it can be kinda pointless at times. Because each time, he stopped taking his medication. And I don't think they particularly checked up on him to MAKE sure he was taking his meds.
=| So yeah, that's what I know about all of that. Mental illness runs in my family. and now you know why I'm so cRRRrrraaAAAZzzzy.

its pretty easy to get someone in one of those places. a few small cuts on a wrist could do it. however, hard to make them stay there. usually a 72 hour thing at the most.

 

[Renia]

its pretty easy to get someone in one of those places. a few small cuts on a wrist could do it. however, hard to make them stay there. usually a 72 hour thing at the most.

Well, my family member is also very clever, in addition to being...ill. So he's VERY good at lying and appearing okay, when infact he's not okay at all.

That's the thing, you can lock them up, but they can easily just get right back out and just, stop trying to get better.

 

[nugz]

Well, my family member is also very clever, in addition to being...ill. So he's VERY good at lying and appearing okay, when infact he's not okay at all.

That's the thing, you can lock them up, but they can easily just get right back out and just, stop trying to get better.

that is true. to a point you can lie your way out. you say "im not crazy!" and they have no reason to not believe you, they kinda have to.

 

[Renia]

that is true. to a point you can lie your way out. you say "im not crazy!" and they have no reason to not believe you, they kinda have to.

and a good portion of the time, people who are crazy...don't think they are. so in a way, they ARE telling the truth... to them. So it sounds slightly more convincing.

Either way, the one time I can actually remember where we for sure were able to commit the family member for a long time, was when he walked from one town, to another, ending up in Elgin wearing no clothes besides his boxers, walking down the traintracks.

That's when we were able to keep him in for a while. but he got out again. *shrugs* I'm lucky that I'm not completely crazy, I've told my dad if I did ever go loco, that he has full permission to lock me the hell up. I'm sure I'm bipolar too, at least a little. My entire family cannot be born without some sort of crazieness.

 

[nugz]

and a good portion of the time, people who are crazy...don't think they are. so in a way, they ARE telling the truth... to them. So it sounds slightly more convincing.

.

actually, i think its more so cuz "crazy" people are also usually very smart. and not even crazy necessarily. most of those people are addicts or severe depressives who have attempted suicide. its not that theyre crazy so much its that they dont wanna be locked up. not as in jail, but just, thrown somewhere against their will. i mean, who would? they wanna go home and continue hating themselves or doing drugs or whatever. takes work to get help and try to change. not easy. people dont wanna put in the effort. thats what it is.

 

[Cassius]

Do any of you remember that urban legend about a college student who acts crazy in order to get into a mental institution? He gets tired of being there, but when he tells them he isn't really crazy they don't believe him and keep him there. Three weeks later his girlfriend goes looking for him there, and they find him...COMPLETELY INSANE! *evil laugh*

 

[Buzzetta]

Do any of you remember that urban legend about a college student who acts crazy in order to get into a mental institution? He gets tired of being there, but when he tells them he isn't really crazy they don't believe him and keep him there. Three weeks later his girlfriend goes looking for him there, and they find him...COMPLETELY INSANE! *evil laugh*

That was a deviation from the plot of One Flew Over the Cookoo's Nest

 

[chica]

This... this "artist" to me makes a mockery to every woman to ever wanted to become pregnant and cannot. It makes a mockery of every woman who ever chose to get an abortion for whatever her personal reasons were.

Sure, but she has the right to do that... It's still legal, isn't it? Or has not showing consideration for other people's feelings become unlawful?

I imagine you can be self destructive to a point and sane (sane as far as medical professionals are concerned, you and I can have our own definitions of sanity but they shouldn't account for much)

 

[Cassius]

That was a deviation from the plot of One Flew Over the Cookoo's Nest

Is it? I just saw it on some urban legend show a few days ago.

 

[nugz]

That was a deviation from the plot of One Flew Over the Cookoo's Nest

great movie!!!

 

[Cassius]

Sure, but she has the right to do that... It's still legal, isn't it?

It is her right but it is being grossly abused.

I wonder how Yale feels about this?

 

[Buzzetta]

Sure, but she has the right to do that... It's still legal, isn't it? Or has not showing consideration for other people's feelings become unlawful?

I imagine you can be self destructive to a point and sane (sane as far as medical professionals are concerned, you and I can have our own definitions of sanity but they shouldn't account for much)

My argument against her would not focus on the abortion issue as it could easily be countered with the result of Roe v. Wade. My argument would focus on the fact that she is seeking insemination and abortion for the sole reason to cause unnecessary and repeated trauma to her body. Therein lies the problem. The abortion decision allows women to make the choice to terminate a pregnancy. However does the decision cover willfully impregnating yourself with a premeditated abortion in mind.

It could be easily reasoned that since the person seeks not to become pregnant and then abort the fetus for any other reason than to cause repeated harm on herself that she was mentally incapable. if she did this just once then she could counter that she wanted a baby then decided against it and the courts may frown on it but nothing would happen. However this is a repeated action. That is the difference.

 

[chica]

It is her right but it is being grossly abused.

I wonder how Yale feels about this?

As far as she didn't hurt anyone (but herself, maybe) I don't see why it should matter.

Yale doesn't want anyone to rock the boat, think independently or do unconventional things. Apparently being mediocre is their preferred quality in students

 

[chica]

It could be easily reasoned that since the person seeks not to become pregnant and then abort the fetus for any other reason than to cause repeated harm on herself that she was mentally incapable.

No, her explanation why she did it was perfectly reasonable. Eccentric doesn't equal insane.

if she did this just once then she could counter that she wanted a baby then decided against it and the courts may frown on it but nothing would happen. However this is a repeated action. That is the difference.

I don't get this. If I, for example, intentionally burned my hands because I wanted to have scars on them as some point of artistic expression, would that mean I should be locked up? You have a very strict definition of individual liberty, I noticed that when you suggested that political opposition leave your country Are you sure you're, you know, American?

 

[Buzzetta]

No, her explanation why she did it was perfectly reasonable. Eccentric doesn't equal insane.



I don't get this. If I, for example, intentionally burned my hands because I wanted to have scars on them as some point of artistic expression, would that mean I should be locked up? You have a very strict definition of individual liberty, I noticed that when you suggested that political opposition leave your country Are you sure you're, you know, American?

To tell the truth I am simply presenting what could be the legal argument for doing so. That is why if I were the prosecution I said I would not focus on the abortion angle but on repeated elective intrusive and traumatic surgery that can and sometimes does result in complications including death.

In America as Nugz said they will put you in a ward for repeatedly cutting yourself and sometimes for those that suffer from bulimia or anorexia as those are also presented as self destructive repeated actions that deserve intervention of some sort.

What I should have added was that it would most likely need to have a "next of kin" or other relative to make the claim.

Chica this should not surprise you. This occurs here in the US more than most people realize. One need look no further than "power of attorney" rights where relatives will legally claim that a relative is no longer of sound mind and body and gain custody of their estate. In some cases it is solely for benevolent reasons and in others though it is for the sole purpose to legally defraud the individual.