Where is the Lyrical Depth?

spinelessswine

New Member
perfect observation

Thank you :)

It's genuinely the way I see it - Adams used to beautifully sum up his emotions and created a world lyrically and musically in which you could lose yourself. Now he is writing lyrical pastiches of himself and playing plodding pubrock.

A bit too similar to what we have on YoR for my liking!
 

Vauxhall95

I Know It's Over...
Maybe you cynics just need to dig a little deeper, beyond High School English Introduction to Metaphors. This thread is vapid.

No really, tell us what you really think of us!:)

After several more listens, I'm certainly willing to edit my original opinion to some degree. "It's Not Your Birthday Anymore" is a good Morrissey tune. Also, I think the studio versions of the four songs played on tour are all very good. Additionally, AYNIM is great - always was.

However, "Black Cloud" is indefensible. The lyrics are banal and just when the music gets interesting the song ends. On the opposite end of the spectrum is "You Were Good in Your Time." I'm listening to this song thinking it's going to be an instant classic and then there is the senseless breakdown on the end ruining what could have been a brilliant song. The others are just so-so (IMO).

Again, it sounds like plenty of b-sides have been recorded, so I'm sure we'll get the usual genius.

P.S. I'll buy the album for the cover photo alone but please don't tell me my opinion is "vapid" and then offer nothing in the form of a counter argument.:)
 

Vauxhall95

I Know It's Over...
That's the damnable thing about him. I cannot get enough of his music, so I want an album every year or two, but I think you're spot on when you write, "...Morrissey is like a mature wine the longer you leave him write, the quality from him is much better." Seven years without him was unbearable! I guess we reap the best from YOR (and there are some good/great songs) and hope for rich b-sides.

I want to hear "I Am Bully Do Not Forget Me!!!!!":)

I am also dissapointed after my first listen,apart from something is squeezing my skull and mama the only song that stands out is its not your birthday anymore,this song starts out brilliant and really goes somehere but his wailing in the 2nd half of the song goes on a bit,
my view of things are he had 7yrs to write (lyrically and musically) some absolute crackers for yatq , and i think as of the morrissey now, bringing out an album every 2 yrs i feel with more time between each album the quality would be richer (lyrically and music),,
yatq deluxe version was a cracking collection of songs along with the extra tracks ie,friday mourning,,mexico etc (which may i say are far better than y.o.r),but these songs came in a 7 yr break(recording wise)

I am gonna wait for the deluxe version of y.o.r and hope for some cracking b sides...
I feel morrissey is like a mature wine the longer you leave him write, the quality from him is much better...steve.
 

CrystalGeezer

My secret's my enzyme.
please don't tell me my opinion is "vapid" and then offer nothing in the form of a counter argument.:)

I said the thread was vapid in response to you saying the lyrics were vapid. From what I gather your lyrical analysis concludes by suggesting there will never be a "classic" in this album so by default no true meaning can be gleaned from the lyrical content. There's so many logical fallacies within the broader context of "Where is the Lyrical Depth?" that I conclude the thread is the very word you chose to describe the album, a waste of time. Shame on you.
 

Vauxhall95

I Know It's Over...
I don't believe in New Year's Resolutions, but I may just start. I promise to not get into any internet pissing contests anymore.

I never wrote the album was a waste of time. I wrote the first several songs were quite good. I also wrote, in my opinion, the lyrics were not as strong as Morrissey's previous efforts.

I realize over the last eight years of the Bush Administration there have been a lot of changes in the law; however, I'm fairly certain I'm still entitled to my opinion.:)


I said the thread was vapid in response to you saying the lyrics were vapid. From what I gather your lyrical analysis concludes by suggesting there will never be a "classic" in this album so by default no true meaning can be gleaned from the lyrical content. There's so many logical fallacies within the broader context of "Where is the Lyrical Depth?" that I conclude the thread is the very word you chose to describe the album, a waste of time. Shame on you.
 

CrystalGeezer

My secret's my enzyme.
Fine. You can have you guns too so you can shoot down any possibility of an intellectual discussion about the lyrics. :)
 

Vauxhall95

I Know It's Over...
Fine. You can have you guns too so you can shoot down any possibility of an intellectual discussion about the lyrics. :)

I'm up for an intellectual discussion. I thought my posts were thoughtful enough given it was after a first listen. All I'm saying is I love the man too, so if we have a difference of opinion there is no need to type five letter words.:)

Vaux:)
 

CrystalGeezer

My secret's my enzyme.
I'm up for an intellectual discussion. I thought my posts were thoughtful enough given it was after a first listen. All I'm saying is I love the man too, so if we have a difference of opinion there is no need to type five letter words.:)

Vaux:)

Okay, I'll look at your side and offer my thoughts and we can maybe meld our ideas together. It was just the subject of the thread that bothered me I suppose because I feel it's a very deep album. I have to take my mom to the mall first though. :o Later?
 
i personally don't think the lyrics are the be all and end all. as long as the lyrics aren't completly ridiculous all's well if the tune's good:guitar:
 

Mike Mozfan

cardholder since 1999
I am glad that someone has pointed this out. I don't think there has been ANY lyrical depth since at least Maladjusted, maybe even earlier. I do get tired of hearing Moz bemoan life in general, seems like a great genre for the depressed. It could also be perhaps the music itself; he hasn't written or co-written a song in years that the melody sticks in your head. I think the album Vauxhall was the last to have any musical value when it comes to the music itself. I know many will disagree, but the last 12 years or so of music to me has been very disappointing, maybe 15. I hear tthe newer releases and think sos. 3 chords and that is about it. Who is he co-writing with now? I ask because I think it's very sub-standard especially for such a talented man as Morrissey. Oh well, that is my 2 cents, you can beat me up for it, but we all have a right to express our feelings. :guitar:
 

Vauxhall95

I Know It's Over...
Okay, I'll look at your side and offer my thoughts and we can maybe meld our ideas together. It was just the subject of the thread that bothered me I suppose because I feel it's a very deep album. I have to take my mom to the mall first though. :o Later?

Deal!:) I just had to take my son to the pharmacy. Life happens, it's so very annoying...:)
 

Vauxhall95

I Know It's Over...
Oh dear... I've always valued your opinion, Vauxhall. Unless you're talking about America ;) I shall try to listen with an unbiased ear in February. Good luck, I know. ;)

I voted for Obama! I think you're confusing me with Vauxhall94 (a common occurrence).:) He's a real American American.:)
 

Corrissey

lovable loser
As I said in another thread, lyrically it feels like he's trying to write "A Morrissey Song" instead of a Morrissey song.

Interesting.

i personally don't think the lyrics are the be all and end all. as long as the lyrics aren't completly ridiculous all's well if the tune's good:guitar:

I agree. Unless the lyrics include stuff like "shit" or "puke"... :rolleyes: I hate that.

I'm enjoying everyone's reviews, good and bad, but I can't form a full opinion until I hear the record myself. *willpower don't fail me now!* Not everything he does appeals to the masses. Take Kill Uncle for example. ;)

I voted for Obama! I think you're confusing me with Vauxhall94 (a common occurrence).:) He's a real American American.:)

No confusion. I was referring to America is Not the World.
 

CrystalGeezer

My secret's my enzyme.
IMO, this is the first Morrissey album in which he fails to deliver the goods: no witty insights, sly one liners, just average run of the mill fair here.

Hi Vaux. It's me again.

Okay, so you say the album lacks "lyrical depth," yet your argument seems to lament that there are no witty insights or easily quotable one liners, etc..

To me this album is the epitome of lyrical depth. For example, Mama Lay Softly on the Riverbed questions why a "mother" or someone named mama would do something perhaps unsavory, then resolves to defend said person from the people who pushed her into doing it, not placing blame on her for doing it, but recognizing the same temptation in himself and empathizing with the situation with the resolve to protect her from future attack. This "mama" is no doubt MOTHER EARTH herself, for the goal is to lie down beside her (in his grave in the EARTH) and be sheltered with her. He alludes to kissing her as well, much like a man praying to heaven kisses the ground like a sun salutation in yoga. And who is this we? Is Morrissey the voice of many who seek to bond and be connected with the safety of Mother Earth? He's onto something here. I just caution you not to discount the lyrical depth while looking for witty one liners when the fabric of an awakening is right in front of your eyes, though perhaps it's foolish of me to cast pearls before swine, but I'm eager to hear your opinion. :)
 
Interesting.



I agree. Unless the lyrics include stuff like "shit" or "puke"... :rolleyes: I hate that.

I'm enjoying everyone's reviews, good and bad, but I can't form a full opinion until I hear the record myself. *willpower don't fail me now!* Not everything he does appeals to the masses. Take Kill Uncle for example. ;)


;););) me and kill uncle get on very well together.......most of the time:guitar:
 

dizzywhore_1804

A big-nose who knows...
For example, Mama Lay Softly on the Riverbed questions why a "mother" or someone named mama would do something perhaps unsavory, then resolves to defend said person from the people who pushed her into doing it, not placing blame on her for doing it, but recognizing the same temptation in himself and empathizing with the situation with the resolve to protect her from future attack. This "mama" is no doubt MOTHER EARTH herself, for the goal is to lie down beside her (in his grave in the EARTH) and be sheltered with her. He alludes to kissing her as well, much like a man praying to heaven kisses the ground like a sun salutation in yoga. And who is this we? Is Morrissey the voice of many who seek to bond and be connected with the safety of Mother Earth? He's onto something here.

Wow, that is both something I had never thought of and yet instantly disagree with.
You can grab the latest dire pop song by anyone and crowbar depth into it, and you usually end up stretching it to a quite unbelievable conclusion.
There is as far as I'm aware nothing in the song that would make allusions think of Mother Earth (what an awful term). I agree with the first part of your analysis but it falls down at the Earth stuff, I just don't think there is anything to back it up.

My problem is that there seems to be no thinking behind the lyrics, most of them can be summed up quite easily in a sentence or two.
I'd be interested in seeing how many times in this album very obvious references to rejection are made.

I'm sure people will disagree with me, but I find that by focusing almost the entire album on his own feelings it lacks any sort of empathy.
With the exception of 'Skull', 'Carol' and 'Mama' there doesn't seem to be any other themes in the album other than being turned down. Which wouldn't be a problem for me, as it is a HUGE subject, except Morrissey has dealt with this theme countless times before and done it much more eloquent way.
Much of the album deals with themes much better expressed in previous albums.

Kills me to say it but some of the songs sound like a very good Morrissey impersonator trying some new material. I feel it lacks some of the magic. Which is horrible, but how I feel.

I've only heard it a few times (although I am already finding myself skipping certain songs) so hopefully it'll grow on me as a whole. Hearing songs live also help, so we'll see how I feel in May.

I'd love to love the album, but so far it's not blown me away.
 

CrystalGeezer

My secret's my enzyme.
Wow, that is both something I had never thought of and yet instantly disagree with.
You can grab the latest dire pop song by anyone and crowbar depth into it, and you usually end up stretching it to a quite unbelievable conclusion.
There is as far as I'm aware nothing in the song that would make allusions think of Mother Earth (what an awful term). I agree with the first part of your analysis but it falls down at the Earth stuff, I just don't think there is anything to back it up.

You don't think being sheltered WITH mama in his GRAVE (which is in the earth) is an allusion to mother earth, an awful term? :confused: Go read the lyrics again.

Or is the term Mother Earth awful to you because it's full of awe?
 

dizzywhore_1804

A big-nose who knows...
You don't think being sheltered WITH mama in his GRAVE (which is in the earth) is an allusion to mother earth, an awful term? :confused: Go read the lyrics again.

Or is the term Mother Earth awful to you because it's full of awe?

Nope - I'd say the chances are (judging by all the references to money-men, civil servants etc) it's more about the very literal alleged hounding of his family by the courts when he lost the court case.

And I find the term 'Mother Earth' just a quite gross phrase, I'm not sure why. I think Captain Planet tainted it for me.
 
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