Morrissey and shyness - "Shrinking Violets" - a BBC4 Extra documentary

Just driven up from down South and on the way listened to this fascinating documentary on shyness. Talks about a lot of interesting historical figures, but also some more modern ones, and their struggle with shyness, including L.S Lowry, George Best, Bobby Charlton and Morrissey. Really good listen. Moz section begins at 49m 38s.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b07s3jlp


UPDATE 3:15 PM PT:

Related link posted by Bluebirds:

Shrinking Violets by Joe Moran review – how to understand shyness - The Guardian
Is being shy a boon or a burden? Should it be fought against? This sparkling cultural history ranges from Jane Austen to Silicon Valley
 
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Oh I wonder why he was never convicted. Couldn't have anything to do with the $200m of hush money he paid out, could it?

I know you are butthurt because of the religion thingie. It was really arsey of you to downvote my thoughts on religion - nobody is keeping you from believing in your invisible friend in the sky, but I'm afraid you will have to accept that some people dislike religion.
im guessing you know a lot about the psychology of pedophiles to make that statement, huh? or.... could it be that you know absolutely nothing at all about the matter?

do you know what kind of kids michael jackson befriended? sick kids, and kids of those who were rich and famous. pedophiles dont befriend these types of kids, because:
1) pedophiles are attracted to children that embody the qualities of childhood: innocence, health, vitality, the quality of being carefree. children who are sick do not have this. do you know who ryan white was? he was a hemophiliac kid from indiana who contracted aids through a tainted blood transfusion, back in the 80s--a time when people treated those who had aids like it was the plague. people mercilessly harassed ryan white and his mother: claiming she was unfit, vandalizing their property, even forcing ryan white to be removed from school. michael jackson befriended ryan white, bought him a car, visited him in the hospital, and later, when ryan white died, wrote the song "gone too soon" for him, and would call up ryan's mothers every year on mothers day to wish her a happy mothers days. are these the actions of a pedophile, or someone who genuinely cared about children? what pedophile would be interested in a child with aids?
2) pedophiles pray upon those who have very little power in society, so as to make them easy prey and susceptible to bribes. michael jackson was friends with baron von thurn und taxis, from one of europes richest aristocratic familes. a family, that had michael touched their child inappropriately, could have destroyed michael. would they have any interest in millions of dollars of "hush money"? highly doubtful.

you could say that these are a couple of cases where michael jackson didnt play the part of pedophile, while elsewhere molesting children, but the thing about child molestors is they cant help themselves around children. they would not have a clean friendly relationship with one child, while molesting another. they also usually have hundreds of victims. michael jackson was friends with so many children, if he was a molestor, HUNDREDS would have been coming out of the woodwork to accuse him, but on the contrary, they have defended him. instead we have TWO people who have accused him. let's look at those two people:
*the first was the child of a man who worked and was friends with michael jackson. the man and michael had a falling out, and shortly after the man was recorded on video tape saying "if this thing goes through, i win big. there's no way i can lose". later, the child, under a controversial drug, told a psychiatrist that he had been molested by michael jackson. fast forward years later and the child is an adult, ADMITTING that he lied.
*the second child was from a family of known con-artists, who had been involved in other schemes before the accusations against michael. the children had been taking acting lessons before michael jacksons trial, and this was one of the things the jury mentioned in finding michael jackson not guilty, that it seemed to them like the child "was acting". one of the things the family wanted out of the trial was a movie contract (or something similar). is that really what you would go for if your child has been molested?

fact is, you dont know what you're talking about.

i will finish by quoting something by oscar wilde:
those who find ugly meanings in beautiful things are corrupt without being charming. this is a fault.
 
TGDR/L

But shrinking pansy more like.

am listening to Noel. hence the bluntness
 
according to yesterdays daily record Michael Jackson is still alive.
 
im guessing you know a lot about the psychology of pedophiles to make that statement, huh? or.... could it be that you know absolutely nothing at all about the matter?

do you know what kind of kids michael jackson befriended? sick kids, and kids of those who were rich and famous. pedophiles dont befriend these types of kids, because:
1) pedophiles are attracted to children that embody the qualities of childhood: innocence, health, vitality, the quality of being carefree. children who are sick do not have this. do you know who ryan white was? he was a hemophiliac kid from indiana who contracted aids through a tainted blood transfusion, back in the 80s--a time when people treated those who had aids like it was the plague. people mercilessly harassed ryan white and his mother: claiming she was unfit, vandalizing their property, even forcing ryan white to be removed from school. michael jackson befriended ryan white, bought him a car, visited him in the hospital, and later, when ryan white died, wrote the song "gone too soon" for him, and would call up ryan's mothers every year on mothers day to wish her a happy mothers days. are these the actions of a pedophile, or someone who genuinely cared about children? what pedophile would be interested in a child with aids?
2) pedophiles pray upon those who have very little power in society, so as to make them easy prey and susceptible to bribes. michael jackson was friends with baron von thurn und taxis, from one of europes richest aristocratic familes. a family, that had michael touched their child inappropriately, could have destroyed michael. would they have any interest in millions of dollars of "hush money"? highly doubtful.

you could say that these are a couple of cases where michael jackson didnt play the part of pedophile, while elsewhere molesting children, but the thing about child molestors is they cant help themselves around children. they would not have a clean friendly relationship with one child, while molesting another. they also usually have hundreds of victims. michael jackson was friends with so many children, if he was a molestor, HUNDREDS would have been coming out of the woodwork to accuse him, but on the contrary, they have defended him. instead we have TWO people who have accused him. let's look at those two people:
*the first was the child of a man who worked and was friends with michael jackson. the man and michael had a falling out, and shortly after the man was recorded on video tape saying "if this thing goes through, i win big. there's no way i can lose". later, the child, under a controversial drug, told a psychiatrist that he had been molested by michael jackson. fast forward years later and the child is an adult, ADMITTING that he lied.
*the second child was from a family of known con-artists, who had been involved in other schemes before the accusations against michael. the children had been taking acting lessons before michael jacksons trial, and this was one of the things the jury mentioned in finding michael jackson not guilty, that it seemed to them like the child "was acting". one of the things the family wanted out of the trial was a movie contract (or something similar). is that really what you would go for if your child has been molested?

fact is, you dont know what you're talking about.

i will finish by quoting something by oscar wilde:
those who find ugly meanings in beautiful things are corrupt without being charming. this is a fault.
Wow thank you for this most truthful post! Thank you for writing about Ryan White's story he was an American teenager from Kokomo, Indiana. Ryan White was expelled from middle school because he contracted HIV/AIDS. Ryan White was a hemophiliac and he became infected with HIV from a contaminated blood treatment/transfusion. Michael Jackson was very fond of Ryan White and was also close to his mother and his family. Michael was devastated when Ryan White died and he wrote the song "Gone Too Soon" in tribute to him.

Thank you for also telling the truth about Jordan ('Jordy') Chandler and his father the late Evan Chandler. Evan Chandler was very jealous of Michael Jackson. The sad thing is I don't think Jordan Chandler did ever admit he lied and he has never apologised for what he did to MJ. After Michael Jackson died in 2009 there were reports in the press that Jordan Chandler admitted he lied but I'm not sure the reports were ever validated?

Evan Chandler was forced to admit the controversial sedative sodium amytal was used when he extracted a tooth from his son Jordan. Studies done in 1952 debunked the drug as a 'truth serum' and demonstrated it actually enabled false memories to be easily implanted. Evan Chandler was a dentist with celebrity clients/patients like Mick Hucknall and Carrie Fisher. I don't think Evan Chandler ever worked for Michael Jackson as far as I know? Evan Chandler wanted funding to become a successful screenwriter in Hollywood but Michael Jackson wouldn't give him the money he wanted. Evan Chandler was very abusive towards his son Jordan and was very violent. Evan Chandler supposedly committed suicide (via a supposedly self-inflicted gunshot wound to the head) on 5th November, 2009, in his luxury waterfront apartment in Jersey City, New Jersey, four months and eleven days after the death of Michael Jackson. Some think he was maybe taken out because he knew a lot?

The Jordan Chandler thing started because Michael Jackson was being chauffeured through Santa Monica, near Los Angeles, when his limousine broke down and his driver/chauffeur sought help at the nearby depot of a car-hire company called 'Rent-A-Wreck'. The boss was Jordan Chandler's stepfather, David Schwarz. David had married Jordan's mother, June, a striking former model, after her 11-year marriage to Evan Chandler ended in 1985. A starry-eyed Jordan Chandler, then aged 12, was ushered in to meet Michael Jackson for the first time.

Thank you for also telling the truth about Gavin Arvizo and his troubled family. MJ helped cure Gavin Arvizo of cancer. This is an interesting article about Gavin Arvizo and his family: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/wor...admits-saying-Jackson-did-not-molest-him.html

I think Gavin Arvizo's full name is Gavin Anton Arvizo. I think he changed his name to Anton Jackson at one point because his stepfather's surname by strange coincidence is 'Jackson'.

This is interesting what Princess Elisabeth von Thurn und Taxis said about Michael Jackson. During her childhood, Elisabeth and her siblings were frequent guests of Michael Jackson at his Neverland Ranch, visits she recalled in her blog after his sudden death in 2009. Describing Michael Jackson as "excruciatingly shy," she defended his reputation, writing, "I couldn't imagine Michael hurting a fly, let alone a friend."

The story of David Rothenberg better known as 'Dave Dave' is also interesting. David's own father deliberately set fire to David's bed in a Buena Park motel room in 1983, burning over 90% of his body. Michael Jackson was a lifelong friend of Dave Dave and was like a father figure to him.

There are many other stories like these!

Wade Robson and Jimmy Safechuck were both supportive of Michael Jackson when he was alive but betrayed him in death thankfully their cases were both dismissed in the end.

God bless you.
 
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Wow thank you for this most truthful post! Thank you for writing about Ryan White's story he was an American teenager from Kokomo, Indiana. Ryan White was expelled from middle school because he contracted HIV/AIDS. Ryan White became infected with HIV from a contaminated blood treatment/transfusion. Michael Jackson was very fond of Ryan White and was also close to his family. Michael was devastated when Ryan White died and he wrote the song "Gone Too Soon" in tribute to him.

Thank you for also telling the truth about Jordy Chandler and his father the late Evan Chandler. Thank you for also telling the truth about Gavin Arvizo (MJ helped cure him of cancer) and his troubled family.

This is interesting what Princess Elisabeth von Thurn und Taxis said about Michael Jackson. During her childhood, Elisabeth and her siblings were frequent guests of Michael Jackson at his Neverland Ranch, visits she recalled in her blog after his sudden death in 2009. Describing Michael Jackson as "excruciatingly shy," she defended his reputation, writing, "I couldn't imagine Michael hurting a fly, let alone a friend."

God bless you.
You sound like a religious fanatic.
 
You sound like a religious fanatic.
I'm sorry if I sound that way as that was not my intention the majority of my post was about Michael Jackson only at the end of my post did I say "God bless you". I'm sorry if you take offense to my wishing God would bless someone. Michael Jackson used to say that all the time "God bless you". Michael Jackson used to say "I love you more" as well.

Please refer back to my previous post on this thread where I go into some length about my dislike for organised religion. It is possible to be a Christian and also be against organised religion such as the Roman Catholic church system! I talk about the spirituality of true faith. I wouldn't say I was religious at all. I would say I'm a follower of Christ.

Anyway lets get things back on track and start talking about 'shyness' which is what this thread is supposed to be about not religion.
 
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I'm sorry if I sound that way as that was not my intention the majority of my post was about Michael Jackson only at the end of my post did I say "God bless you". I'm sorry if you take offense to my wishing God would bless someone. Michael used to say that all the time "God bless you". Michael used to say "I love you more" as well. Please refer back to my previous post on this thread where I go into some length about my dislike for organised religion. It is possible to be a Christian and also be against organised religion such as the Roman Catholic church system! I talk about the spirituality of true faith. I wouldn't say I was religious at all. I would say I'm a follower of Christ.

Anyway lets get things back on track and start talking about 'shyness' which is what this thread is supposed to be about not religion.

I thought you said you weren't posting anymore? You're ill Andrea. Get some help.
 
im guessing you know a lot about the psychology of pedophiles to make that statement, huh? or.... could it be that you know absolutely nothing at all about the matter?

do you know what kind of kids michael jackson befriended? sick kids, and kids of those who were rich and famous. pedophiles dont befriend these types of kids, because:
1) pedophiles are attracted to children that embody the qualities of childhood: innocence, health, vitality, the quality of being carefree. children who are sick do not have this. do you know who ryan white was? he was a hemophiliac kid from indiana who contracted aids through a tainted blood transfusion, back in the 80s--a time when people treated those who had aids like it was the plague. people mercilessly harassed ryan white and his mother: claiming she was unfit, vandalizing their property, even forcing ryan white to be removed from school. michael jackson befriended ryan white, bought him a car, visited him in the hospital, and later, when ryan white died, wrote the song "gone too soon" for him, and would call up ryan's mothers every year on mothers day to wish her a happy mothers days. are these the actions of a pedophile, or someone who genuinely cared about children? what pedophile would be interested in a child with aids?
2) pedophiles pray upon those who have very little power in society, so as to make them easy prey and susceptible to bribes. michael jackson was friends with baron von thurn und taxis, from one of europes richest aristocratic familes. a family, that had michael touched their child inappropriately, could have destroyed michael. would they have any interest in millions of dollars of "hush money"? highly doubtful.

you could say that these are a couple of cases where michael jackson didnt play the part of pedophile, while elsewhere molesting children, but the thing about child molestors is they cant help themselves around children. they would not have a clean friendly relationship with one child, while molesting another. they also usually have hundreds of victims. michael jackson was friends with so many children, if he was a molestor, HUNDREDS would have been coming out of the woodwork to accuse him, but on the contrary, they have defended him. instead we have TWO people who have accused him. let's look at those two people:
*the first was the child of a man who worked and was friends with michael jackson. the man and michael had a falling out, and shortly after the man was recorded on video tape saying "if this thing goes through, i win big. there's no way i can lose". later, the child, under a controversial drug, told a psychiatrist that he had been molested by michael jackson. fast forward years later and the child is an adult, ADMITTING that he lied.
*the second child was from a family of known con-artists, who had been involved in other schemes before the accusations against michael. the children had been taking acting lessons before michael jacksons trial, and this was one of the things the jury mentioned in finding michael jackson not guilty, that it seemed to them like the child "was acting". one of the things the family wanted out of the trial was a movie contract (or something similar). is that really what you would go for if your child has been molested?

fact is, you dont know what you're talking about.

i will finish by quoting something by oscar wilde:
those who find ugly meanings in beautiful things are corrupt without being charming. this is a fault.

You really believe that, don't you? There are just too many credible witnesses to the nasty stuff with the kiddies but no no no Michael was a good guy, he helped them. Did it all out of love. He even cured a kid of cancer. :barf:

Even if all he is guilty of is sleeping in the same bed as vulnerable little boys (I don't believe that) it's still abuse of sorts.

Stop defending the indefensible just because you like Billie Jean.
 
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Wow thank you for this most truthful post! Thank you for writing about Ryan White's story he was an American teenager from Kokomo, Indiana. Ryan White was expelled from middle school because he contracted HIV/AIDS. Ryan White became infected with HIV from a contaminated blood treatment/transfusion. Michael Jackson was very fond of Ryan White and was also close to his family. Michael was devastated when Ryan White died and he wrote the song "Gone Too Soon" in tribute to him.

Thank you for also telling the truth about Jordy Chandler and his father the late Evan Chandler. Thank you for also telling the truth about Gavin Arvizo (MJ helped cure him of cancer) and his troubled family.

This is interesting what Princess Elisabeth von Thurn und Taxis said about Michael Jackson. During her childhood, Elisabeth and her siblings were frequent guests of Michael Jackson at his Neverland Ranch, visits she recalled in her blog after his sudden death in 2009. Describing Michael Jackson as "excruciatingly shy," she defended his reputation, writing, "I couldn't imagine Michael hurting a fly, let alone a friend."

The story of David Rothenberg better known as 'Dave Dave' is also interesting. David's own father deliberately set fire to David's bed in a Buena Park motel room in 1983, burning over 90% of his body. Michael Jackson was a lifelong friend of Dave Dave and was like a father figure to him.

There are many other stories like these!

Wade Robson and Jimmy Safechuck were both supportive of Michael Jackson when he was alive but betrayed him in death thankfully their cases were both dismissed in the end.

God bless you.
thank you, that's sweet! me and you, we got michaels back :p
this is nice. ryan was such a cute, special, wise young boy, i can see why michael was so fond of him :)
 
You really believe that, don't you? There are just too many credible witnesses to the nasty stuff with the kiddies but no no no Michael was a good guy, he helped them. Did it all out of love. He even cured a kid of cancer. :barf:

Even if all he is guilty of is sleeping in the same bed as vulnerable little boys (I don't believe that) it's still abuse of sorts.

Stop defending the indefensible just because you like Billie Jean.
what credible witnesses, hmm? can you personally name one?
the fact is, even without one shred of evidence, you would still believe it. why? because you want to believe it. i shudder to think what that says about you.
 
Yeah, thinking that touching young boys inappropriately is, well, inappropriate and that Jackson is guilty (like pretty much the rest of the world apart from a few hero worshippers) obviously says a lot about me. It obviously means I'm a p*dofile. Stupid bitch.
 
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thank you, that's sweet! me and you, we got michaels back :p
this is nice. ryan white was such a cute, special, wise young boy, i can see why michael was so fond of him :)
I will always have Michael Jackson's back! It still hurts everyday that he is no longer around. By rights he should still be alive.

The song "Gone Too Soon" is really beautiful and took on a new meaning for me when Michael Jackson himself died. :tears:
 
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He admitted to Martin Bashir that he had children in his bed eating cookies and milk. What was 45 year old man doing with children that are not his own in his bed? Give me a break.
OJ Simpson was not convicted of slaughtering his ex wife and lover either. Do you believe that too?
Martin Bashir was very manipulative towards Michael Jackson. It was only after Michael Jackson died in 2009 that Martin Bashir started telling the truth. Please see this link Martin Bashir confessed he lied in "Living with Michael Jackson":



I'm not interested in O. J. Simpson and I didn't follow his trial. I don't know if he is innocent or guilty of killing his ex-wife Nicole Brown Simpson and Ron Goldman. O. J. Simpson to me seems like he is maybe a victim of 'mind control' I don't know for sure though. The sad thing about the trial was it became a sort of 'race war' rather than about the truth mostly black people supported O. J. Simpson and mostly white people thought he must be guilty. I know there is a long history of racism and prejudice particularly to do with black men in America so it is hard to know the truth. Hollywood is strange place and a lot of strange things go on there!
 
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Martin Bashir was very manipulative towards Michael Jackson. It was only after Michael Jackson died in 2009 that Martin Bashir started telling the truth. Please see this link Martin Bashir confessed he lied in "Living with Michael Jackson":


I'm not interested in O. J. Simpson and I didn't follow his trial. I don't know if he is innocent or guilty of killing his ex-wife Nicole Brown Simpson and Ron Goldman. To me O. J. Simpson seems like he is a victim of 'mind control' I don't know for sure though. The sad thing about the trial was it became a sort of 'race war' rather than about the truth mainly black people supported O. J. Simpson and white people thought he must be guilty. I know there is a long history of racism and prejudice particularly about black men in America so it is hard to know the truth. Hollywood is strange place and a lot of strange things go on there.

He said he didn't see him in bed with any child, but Jackson said himself that he had invited kids to his house, they slept in his bed. How would you feel if your own father invited the neighbourhood kids for "sleepover" into his bed? Is that appropriate by your standards?
 
He said he didn't see him in bed with any child, but Jackson said himself that he had invited kids to his house, they slept in his bed. How would you feel if your own father invited the neighbourhood kids for "sleepover" into his bed? Is that appropriate by your standards?

If some worker or farmer did that, everyone would think he's guilty. But because it's Michael f***ing Jackson and he wrote Thriller some crazy fanfraus get their panties in a twist.
 
Not angry at all (nothing you say could possibly make me angry). Just pointing out your crass idiocy.
lol, yeah, that's why you gave me a negative rating immediately after the post but took 24 hours to come back and write this 2 sentence reply. you didnt need a cooling off period, did you? teehee

p.s. im still waiting for you to come up with those "credible sources." not that i expect them, of course, because i cant imagine you yourself could possibly have any credibility, but i just thought i'd give you a chance to prove me wrong.

p.p.s "crass idiocy"? you sound like Vegan. next you're going to be remarking on the "tragic irony of my ignorant post" or something similar
 
A cooling off period? For what exactly? LOL Don't flatter yourself. <3

Funny you keep track of what time exactly you received a rating. And how long people take to reply. Maybe you should get out more, just a suggestion. LOLLOLOL *heart*

The onus is not on me to prove that Jackson is innocent. Everyone apart from a few deranged stans accepts that he fondled young boys. I can't even be arsed to provide a link, there's just so much out there.

Now do one you clown.
 
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