Fiona Dodwell: "How Morrissey outran The Smiths (and why his critics will never admit it)" (February 18, 2021)

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How Morrissey outran The Smiths (and why his critics will never admit it)

Excerpt:

"There’s an emergence of voices rising from the rotting grave of political correctness lately, in a feeble attempt to somehow make Morrissey’s art into nothing more than a shadow of The Smiths. In reality though, to many, he was the beating heart of the much-loved 80s quartet and unlike his bandmates, he became so much more.
There are many voices online using the tired old trope, “I won’t listen to Morrissey because I don’t agree with his views, but I’ll always have The Smiths.” If this sentiment were limited only to the dull echo chambers of anonymous social media users, it might not be so bad. Yet it does not stop there."




Regards,
FWD.


Now linked to by Central:

 

Nerak

Reverse Ferret
Weren't you all going on about how he relentlessly champions his causes? Isn't being anti-fur one of them? A PETA anti-fur letter is just something you would expect to find his name on. It's another misstep for him, another missed opportunity to speak out for something righteous.

Relentlessly speaking out for causes doesn't mean you have to add your name to every group letter or front every campaign.
 

Ketamine Sun

<><><><><><><><><><>
Yes, I understand it but I'm just explaining why so many people are mad at him, and the mass desertion of the fanbase.
He clearly doesn't hold consistently right-wing views but he was foolish enough not to realise the conclusion people would reach if he urged them to support a right-wing party.
It's a total clash with everything The Smiths ever stood for, and The Smiths' agenda was largely set by him (however much Marr would like to think otherwise).
It doesn't matter when Gary Barlow says vote for a right-wing party - if anything it reinforces his image. But for Morrissey to do likewise was just unthinkable, reflected in Tim Burgess incredulously observing that Morrissey had become a gammon. Morrissey, of all people! WTF!
Here's the gammon definition from Urban Dictionary.
"They dislike multiculturalism and the 'equality agenda', and obsess about 'lefties', immigrants, Jeremy Corbyn and the fabled liberal metropolitan elite." A little unfair to compare Morrissey to this but perhaps not entirely.

Here’s some video of his last show
and it seems not a bad turnout considering people were told not to attend due to Covid. And even through a pandemic and chance of dying he still hasn’t been deserted by his fans, and if death won’t stop them, what will?

It sounds a bit of an exaggeration, so I don’t know how you come to choose the words ‘mass desertion’ to describe that some fans might not
have bought his new album, because
they either are doing it in protest because they don’t understand why he says what he says, or simply because they’ve grown older and quite naturally moved on in their life.


There’s also some better photos of
the massive audience if you scroll down on this page below ...

 

Nerak

Reverse Ferret
Here’s some video of his last show
and it seems not a bad turnout considering people were told not to attend due to Covid. And even through a pandemic and chance of dying he still hasn’t been deserted by his fans, and if death won’t stop them, what will?

It sounds a bit of an exaggeration, so I don’t know how you come to choose the words ‘mass desertion’ to describe that some fans might not
have bought his new album, because
they either are doing it in protest because they don’t understand why he says what he says, or simply because they’ve grown older and quite naturally moved on in their life.


There’s also some better photos of
the massive audience if you scroll down on this page below ...


Some of us still love him. ❤
 

Ketamine Sun

<><><><><><><><><><>
According to the Yorkshire Post, who were there - https://www.yorkshirepost.co.uk/wha...ew-morrissey-first-direct-arena-leeds-2446005

True, Morrissey’s various musings on politics and social issues, including expressing support for far-right groups, has tainted his image somewhat in recent years.

Where he would once fill venues such as the First Direct Arena in Leeds, his appeal has apparently lessened with the crowd far from capacity.

I don’t know about that. I’m just judging by the photos and reaction of the audience in the videos. I don’t know who this journalist is, and I’m a little bit skeptical because they didn’t mention the crackle of electricity in the air or the waves of love directed at Morrissey during the show. I can pick that up just by watching a few videos, then again, I’m more sensitive and especially attuned to those kind of things than most folks here are.

:cool:
 

Mike Rourke

Active Member
Here’s some video of his last show
and it seems not a bad turnout considering people were told not to attend due to Covid. And even through a pandemic and chance of dying he still hasn’t been deserted by his fans, and if death won’t stop them, what will?

It sounds a bit of an exaggeration, so I don’t know how you come to choose the words ‘mass desertion’ to describe that some fans might not
have bought his new album, because
they either are doing it in protest because they don’t understand why he says what he says, or simply because they’ve grown older and quite naturally moved on in their life.


There’s also some better photos of
the massive audience if you scroll down on this page below ...

2018 was his most popular ever UK tour taking in several arenas with most at least 3/4 full.
And in 2020, the fanbase collapsed both at the concerts and for the new album, despite much greater acclaim than Low in High School.
After 35 years of concerts and albums, did vast numbers suddenly grow older and naturally move on in 2018. Or did something else happen?
But, yes, there are obviously still thousands of people who will see him live. And let's hope a new album will be possible at some point. Dog on a Chain contained some truly great songs.
 
J

Janice

Guest
I don’t know about that. I’m just judging by the photos and reaction of the audience in the videos. I don’t know who this journalist is, and I’m a little bit skeptical because they didn’t mention the crackle of electricity in the air or the waves of love directed at Morrissey during the show. I can pick that up just by watching a few videos, then again, I’m more sensitive and especially attuned to those kind of things than most folks here are.

:cool:
I’ve seem Morrissey 3 times at that Leeds arena, none sold out but, and I’ll say it again; all those present, had a god time. (Or appeared to - the mong Benny the British Butcher aside)
The numbers have gone down in the UK and the US, South America wasn't affected and Europe has only seen 1 gig (Koln) since Berlin 2016, which sold well last March. I don’t personally agree with some of what he says but, I’ll still follow him and I’ll still patrol eBay day and night for something I may not have. I guess I always will. My choice.
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
Here’s some video of his last show
and it seems not a bad turnout considering people were told not to attend due to Covid.
The video you posted was from Leeds. I attended, and it was - at best - 50% full, quite possibly less. This was before the Covid scare kicked in. I've done plenty of previous tours, and never seen a UK show like it.

London was definitely better attended, but whether he can fill anywhere outside the capital on future tours will be interesting. My hunch is any promoter who tries booking him for a run of UK arena dates in the near future is going to get badly burned financially. Maybe he can try the 'farewell tour' trick to drum up some sales, then change his mind two years later - that usually works.
 

Mike Rourke

Active Member
The video you posted was from Leeds. I attended, and it was - at best - 50% full, quite possibly less. This was before the Covid scare kicked in. I've done plenty of previous tours, and never seen a UK show like it.

London was definitely better attended, but whether he can fill anywhere outside the capital on future tours will be interesting. My hunch is any promoter who tries booking him for a run of UK arena dates in the near future is going to get badly burned financially. Maybe he can try the 'farewell tour' trick to drum up some sales, then change his mind two years later - that usually works.
In fairness, the Covid scare was kicking off at the time. I remember the NME review saying that Morrissey's fans had decided to 'socially distance' from him as a result of his recent views. However, I guess the tickets would have gone on sale well before Covid awareness kicked in, and I remember all the talk of poor sales.
 
V

Vegan Cro Spirit 444

Guest
Here’s some video of his last show
and it seems not a bad turnout considering people were told not to attend due to Covid. And even through a pandemic and chance of dying he still hasn’t been deserted by his fans, and if death won’t stop them, what will?

It sounds a bit of an exaggeration, so I don’t know how you come to choose the words ‘mass desertion’ to describe that some fans might not
have bought his new album, because
they either are doing it in protest because they don’t understand why he says what he says, or simply because they’ve grown older and quite naturally moved on in their life.


There’s also some better photos of
the massive audience if you scroll down on this page below ...



😲
the venue is PACKED!!

FULL HOUSE INCREDIBLE WITH

KUNG FLU AND ALL~!~🤓


VEGAS HERE WE COME A SOLD
OUT RESIDENCY🥳




where will little Le:frogface: be playing?:blushing:
 
J

John Paul

Guest
I’ve seem Morrissey 3 times at that Leeds arena, none sold out but, and I’ll say it again; all those present, had a god time. (Or appeared to - the mong Benny the British Butcher aside)
The numbers have gone down in the UK and the US, South America wasn't affected and Europe has only seen 1 gig (Koln) since Berlin 2016, which sold well last March. I don’t personally agree with some of what he says but, I’ll still follow him and I’ll still patrol eBay day and night for something I may not have. I guess I always will. My choice.
What happened to Benny the British Butcher?
 

Ketamine Sun

<><><><><><><><><><>
2018 was his most popular ever UK tour taking in several arenas with most at least 3/4 full.
And in 2020, the fanbase collapsed both at the concerts and for the new album, despite much greater acclaim than Low in High School.

What do you mean ‘collapsed’ ?

IANADOAC would have done good enough if there wasn’t a pandemic shutdown and with no tour and little to no promotion from a label what could one expect? I mean he’s not McCartney or some young ‘do anything for fame’ pop act.
After 35 years of concerts and albums, did vast numbers suddenly grow older and naturally move on in 2018. Or did something else happen?
Who are these vast numbers? Where are these numbers coming from? Not that it matters.

Most artists have a solid fan base and the rest is made up of those that are not as hardcore, they will always come and go, and I think by now Morrissey knows this. Of course most artists would like to keep all their fans along the way, but there comes a time in all artists ‘careers’ that a lot of fans, being fickle, will leave for any reason.
If Morrissey really really cared about this, he would stop speaking from his heart and would do a lot of commercial shit to make more money to compensate for lack of sales from present day releases or
lack of audience members, Smiths reunion anyone?
He doesn’t, so I think we could all safely assume that he’s fine with it and doing fine.

I understand that there will always be those that like to trot out the numbers, but I don’t think that really matters, not anymore.

But, yes, there are obviously still thousands of people who will see him live. And let's hope a new album will be possible at some point. Dog on a Chain contained some truly great songs.

Agree :thumb:

But, if it his choice is not to release another album, then that’s fine too.
 

Ketamine Sun

<><><><><><><><><><>
In fairness, the Covid scare was kicking off at the time. I remember the NME review saying that Morrissey's fans had decided to 'socially distance' from him as a result of his recent views. However, I guess the tickets would have gone on sale well before Covid awareness kicked in, and I remember all the talk of poor sales.


I think a killer virus would stop most fans going to his shows before
some passing misunderstood comments he made in the past.

I mean they went because they love him, regardless of the ticket price, regardless of what their understanding is of what he has said, and regardless of catching a virus that could lead to their own death. A massive amount of fans attended.

Just the videos speak for themselves.
 

Verso

Well-Known Member
2018 was his most popular ever UK tour taking in several arenas with most at least 3/4 full.
And in 2020, the fanbase collapsed both at the concerts and for the new album, despite much greater acclaim than Low in High School.
After 35 years of concerts and albums, did vast numbers suddenly grow older and naturally move on in 2018. Or did something else happen?
But, yes, there are obviously still thousands of people who will see him live. And let's hope a new album will be possible at some point. Dog on a Chain contained some truly great songs.
I personally know a handful of regulars who "broke up" with Morrissey and stopped attending his shows over the last few years. Anecdotal evidence, but I assume my experience isn't particularly unique. That said, I'm not one of them. I disagree with much of what he says and find his output over the last 15 years pretty dreadful, but I always catch a show (or two , depending on the setlist) when he comes through.

I think it's obvious that Morrissey has fewer casual fans than most mainstream artists, so while some may end the relationship out of principle, there are plenty who remain loyal. Show attendance is not always the most accurate method of measurement.
 
J

John Paul

Guest
I personally know a handful of regulars who "broke up" with Morrissey and stopped attending his shows over the last few years. Anecdotal evidence, but I assume my experience isn't particularly unique. That said, I'm not one of them. I disagree with much of what he says and find his output over the last 15 years pretty dreadful, but I always catch a show (or two , depending on the setlist) when he comes through.

I think it's obvious that Morrissey has fewer casual fans than most mainstream artists, so while some may end the relationship out of principle, there are plenty who remain loyal. Show attendance is not always the most accurate method of measurement.
What happened to Benny the British Butcher? Didn't he attend many of Morrissey's shows in the UK?
 
V

Vegan Cro Spirit 444

Guest
I personally know a handful of regulars who "broke up" with Morrissey and stopped attending his shows over the last few years. Anecdotal evidence, but I assume my experience isn't particularly unique. That said, I'm not one of them. I disagree with much of what he says and find his output over the last 15 years pretty dreadful, but I always catch a show (or two , depending on the setlist) when he comes through.

I think it's obvious that Morrissey has fewer casual fans than most mainstream artists, so while some may end the relationship out of principle, there are plenty who remain loyal. Show attendance is not always the most accurate method of measurement.
🧐

no your experience is not particularly unique :)rolleyes: OY).
most moneyless trolls who cant even buy tickets have had
the same experience:crazy:
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
I thought Morrissey was a big supporter of PETA. Why didn't he sign this letter about #FurFreeBritain? I was looking for Morrissey's signature, but I only found Johnny Marr's. Do you think he cancelled PETA or did PETA cancel him?

It sure looks like PETA canceled Moz in favor of Johnny Marr. Can’t really blame them as having Moz on there would detract from the message.
 

Protagonist

Member
I mean... what's she really talking about here? It seems obvious to me that Morrissey developed as a singer and a lyricist in his solo career. The fine voice that he's in from Your Arsensal especially through to, debatably, Years of Refusal makes his singing with The Smiths sound froggy and weak. I also far prefer him as a mature writer, when he's not appointing himself spokesman for every teenager in the UK as he often did in The Smiths.

It's also apparent to me that the strength of the compositions loses something post-Marr. You just don't come across guitar players like him every day, Boz, bless him, does not have that level of virtuosity. Now, since the Smiths, Marr has gone on to be a superstar session musician, he works in a similar vein to Nile Rodgers. There's nothing wrong with that, although I'd reckon that most people prefer his work in The Smiths to, say, his stuff with Modest Mouse, or his album with The Healers.

Morrissey, meanwhile reached some incredibly high heights as a solo act - I do prefer solo Morrissey but I still like the Smiths. He was on track to be revered and loved along the same lines as Cohen, Mitchell, Dylan, but that'll never happen now. He martyred himself in the name of contentious opinions and fringe political parties, and he's surrounded himself with sinister showbiz figures. He seems to me to be very ill. Marr, meanwhile, gets to float down from heaven whenever he wants, drop a cheerful and safe solo album, and join whichever indie band his kids have introduced him to for a year or two without risking "cancelation" or injury to his bank account. There's no use comparing the two, or lionizing Morrissey solo at the expense of The Smiths, and I think this Dodwell woman should take her articles no one asked for to tumblr or Reddit, the argument she makes is so beside the point.
 
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