posted by davidt on Tuesday November 04 2003, @10:00AM
Dr feelgood writes:

A friend of mine is working with the bloke who made the recentish C4 doc on Moz. Apparently all references to homosexuality had to be cut because Moz's mum is a devout Catholic. They also interviewed Kathy Burke who was still livid about the footage of her in the doc. She spent ages saying what an inspiration The Smiths had been to her and they only used a few clips of embarrassing remarks. She was still hostile to any media interviewers.
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  • Removing homosexual references because his mother is catholic? I thought there was far too many homosexual references to begin with. You mean they removed more? Yikes!
    Mannix -- Tuesday November 04 2003, @10:25AM (#78557)
    (User #1379 Info)
  • I find that a bit questionable. Morrissey's mother was a librarian and introduced her son to Wilde. I think it's just presumed that all Irish Catholics are homophobic, when in fact the opposite is very often the case. Maybe he just felt embarrassed about having his sexuality analysed and speculated upon on national t.v. I know I would be.
    Anonymous -- Tuesday November 04 2003, @11:46AM (#78568)
  • I wish that they had left them in...
    Anonymous -- Tuesday November 04 2003, @12:34PM (#78575)
  • strange (Score:1, Troll)

    has she not been reading 1/2 of the lyrics he has written for the past 20 years?

    Roy's Keen for example?
    suzanne -- Tuesday November 04 2003, @01:03PM (#78578)
    (User #36 Info)
    I scare dead people.
    • Re:strange by Anonymous (Score:0) Wednesday November 05 2003, @05:02AM
      • Re:strange by suzanne (Score:1) Wednesday November 05 2003, @01:15PM
        • Re:strange by Anonymous (Score:0) Thursday November 06 2003, @02:34AM
      • Re:strange by Benji (Score:1) Tuesday November 11 2003, @12:44AM
  • There were references to homosexuality....
    Anonymous -- Tuesday November 04 2003, @01:24PM (#78582)
  • Omosexuality is still a sin in catholic vision.
    As far Morrissey is concerned,it's a trite matter. It's useless talk about it until Morrissey himself will say "his" truth.
    Anonymous -- Tuesday November 04 2003, @01:46PM (#78588)
    • Re:It's a sin by Anonymous (Score:0) Tuesday November 04 2003, @02:39PM
      • Re:It's a sin by icicular (Score:1) Tuesday November 04 2003, @03:18PM
    • Re:It's a sin by Anonymous (Score:1) Friday November 07 2003, @05:03AM
  • Gay? (Score:0, Troll)

    well, i have to say that i'm mostly shoked, my dear souls! mister morrissey is not gay, NO WAY, stop freaking around, the man is straight. if he was homo, i would burn his albuns. Moz is macho,
    and someday i'll sleep with him! so it is right to
    not mention such things in a documentary.

    nauthy girl xxxxx
    Anonymous -- Tuesday November 04 2003, @07:57PM (#78622)
  • The documentary did mention homoerotism.And we all know Morrissey`s music contains homoerotic content.But Morrissey doesn`t talk about his sexuality except through his music.Morrissey himself has said that he doesn`t want to be labeled and I think we should respect that.
    tibby -- Tuesday November 04 2003, @08:08PM (#78623)
    (User #2713 Info)
    ~I am a poor freezingly cold soul so far from where I intended to go ~I love Morrissey
  • He was asked to talk about his sexuality and he said "and I'm not going to". "I don't hear anyone talking about sex and sexuality, and what turns them on and turns them off, so I can't think of any reason why I should! I't doesn't help me..."

    Jason Patrick Morris -- Wednesday November 05 2003, @03:31AM (#78648)
    (User #7642 Info)
    • Re:C4 Doc by Anonymous (Score:0) Wednesday November 05 2003, @05:00AM
  • question: Outside the song handsome devil, what exact lyrics refer to homoerotica?

    just wondering...
    Anonymous -- Wednesday November 05 2003, @07:14AM (#78666)
    • Re:One question by Anonymous (Score:0) Wednesday November 05 2003, @08:00AM
      • Re:One question by Anonymous (Score:0) Wednesday November 05 2003, @08:35AM
      • Re:One question by Joemoz (Score:1) Wednesday November 05 2003, @09:56AM
        • Re:One question by Anonymous (Score:0) Wednesday November 05 2003, @12:54PM
        • Re:One question by Anonymous (Score:0) Wednesday November 05 2003, @03:56PM
          • A boy in the 'bush' is worth two in the hand by Anonymous (Score:0) Thursday November 06 2003, @03:09AM
          • Re:One question (Score:2, Insightful)

            Off the top of my head:

            Wonderful Woman
            Dagenham Dave
            Girlfriend in a coma
            Half a person
            Glamorous Glue
            You've had her
            Stop me if you think you've heard this one before
            The Draize Train (just kidding)

            Admittedly, none of these are strongly heterosexual, but the same can be said for the so-called "evidence" of homosexuality.

            Luckily, of course, most of Morrissey's lyrics are elegantly sexually unspecific - dealing with universal emotions and events.

            I am NOT saying that Morrissey is necessarily one or the other, only that the lyrical evidence is inconclusive.
            Joemoz -- Thursday November 06 2003, @06:33AM (#78775)
            (User #1342 Info)
    • Re: "Bite the pillow Jake" by Anonymous (Score:0) Thursday November 06 2003, @05:15AM
    • Re:One question by Mannix (Score:1) Thursday November 06 2003, @06:19PM
  • I probably wrote in too much of a rush. it was references to moz's sexuality that were to be cut. i get the impression his mother's religios beliefs may influence his reticience to be overt about it. however, this is only what i was told , i agree that simplistic titles such asd gay or straight are not always helpful in describing anybodies sexuality. i personally do not trust the observations of the director, when making a doc people often seem to simplify issues or fail to recognise subtle but vital details
    Anonymous -- Wednesday November 05 2003, @07:19AM (#78668)
  • Given what has been said above about how much homoeroticism there is in the lyrics, it could hardly shock his mother that he's browsed the odd Underpants Weekly. Isn't it more likely that he was afraid that his carefully cultivated sexual ambiguity would suddenly seem a lot less ambiguous, and to those who are interested, intriguing, and just offered that as an excuse for the cuts to be made? A good publicist will always scream a journalist into obedient submission.
    Anonymous -- Wednesday November 05 2003, @07:25AM (#78670)
  • If you ever actually "come out" and say "yeah I'm gay" then suddenly every piece of press from there on out will have the term "gay singer" attached to your name! Who the hell wants that? I think Morrissey was smart never to come out. His lyrics from the Smiths days tell the story with such wit and double entendre that all public service announcements about sexuality would be anticlimatic.

    "there is a quick and easy way, you say
    before you illustrate I'd rather state
    I'm not the man you think I am..."
    BobC -- Wednesday November 05 2003, @07:32AM (#78672)
    (User #5785 Info)
  • really? can you be sure?
    KATON -- Wednesday November 05 2003, @09:50AM (#78682)
    (User #9190 Info)
  • so, the reason that Moz is enigmatic about his sexuality is because he's scared of his mum!!

    That explains everything...

    or absolutely nothing...

    depending on your politics or how you want to look at it....
    carnal artist -- Wednesday November 05 2003, @10:52AM (#78693)
    (User #7076 Info)
    • Re:wow.... by KATON (Score:1) Wednesday November 05 2003, @12:02PM
      • Re:wow.... by Anonymous (Score:0) Thursday November 06 2003, @02:36AM
        • Re:wow.... by Anonymous (Score:0) Thursday November 06 2003, @08:20AM
  • yeah (Score:1, Funny)

    I really can't see Morrissey prowling for a bit of T and A!!
    BobC -- Wednesday November 05 2003, @12:44PM (#78699)
    (User #5785 Info)
  • morrissey loves to fondle animals.
    Anonymous -- Wednesday November 05 2003, @01:49PM (#78704)
  • A lot of the Moz/Smiths canon is surprisingly heterosexual.
    "he's got too many girlfriends, I'm jealous, that's all"
    "girlfriend in a coma..."
    "the girl of your dreams is sad and is all alone"
    "where is the woman you love, and where is the man you respect"
    "your weary wife is walking away"
    "young girl, one day you will be old. but the thing is, I love you now"
    Anonymous -- Thursday November 06 2003, @02:41AM (#78753)
  • I study journalism and therefore write a lot of articles. I tell you, there is nothing more annoying than when the people you interview gets pissed because you don't use the quotes they want you to use. It's not like you are writing something that's not true but they still get pissed and I guess it's the same with Kathy Burke... She should know better than that...
    mozzergirl -- Thursday November 06 2003, @04:15AM (#78761)
    (User #2801 Info)
    Will you put your arms around me, I won't tell anybody
  • Gay lyrics:

    "She's too rough and I'm too delicate..."

    "When we're in your skeleton room who will swallow whom?"

    (every word of "This Charming Man" duh)

    "A boy in the bush is worth two in the hands" duh

    "He never really looks at me, I give him every opportunity..."
    BobC -- Thursday November 06 2003, @06:58AM (#78784)
    (User #5785 Info)
  • Have none of you considered the concept that the man is capable of attraction to either sex (all genders?) and is then BIsexual (however he identifies personally)
    BUT it's irrelevant as he doesn't pursue any of them past a certain point of infatuation/flirtation (anyone else hear the stories that old drummer Spencer tells?)
    Anonymous -- Thursday November 06 2003, @07:55AM (#78793)
  • I find it odd that there are people still question Morrissey's sexuality.

    The man is 40something years old.
    Is he married? No?
    Can anyone here name his last 3 girlfriends?
    I bet you can name Ashton Kutcher's last 3 gf's.

    People who are heterosexual constantly flaunt their sexuality. I don't mean to say that in a mean way, but it's just a reality -- and if you're one of these individuals that don't flaunt heterosexuality people may begin assuming you're gay.

    It's not so much that Morrissey may have homoerotic lyrics -- I find that to be somewhat immaterial. What convices me more about his sexuality is that he hasn't had a girlfriend in the longest time. (Please correct me if I'm wrong)

    Has Moz even been rumoured to have been with anyone?

    Just because Moz hasn't been seen in a romatic relation with a woman doesn't automaticlly mean he's gay -- and this is not an inditement of his sexuality, but I think it's highly suspect that you never hear him likned to any woman. It would make me think that he doesn't necessarily fancy them.

    and that's okay in my book.
    equatorial guinea -- Thursday November 06 2003, @09:29AM (#78806)
    (User #5373 Info |
    Eric was a contender
  • Not that it really matters if the man is homo or heterosexal... All of us whom are part of this forum I'm assuming "want" the man. We all want what we can't have. His music is timeless and we'll love him forever regardless.
    Mandy101 -- Thursday November 06 2003, @09:58AM (#78809)
    (User #9245 Info)
    • Re:ummm... by Anonymous (Score:0) Thursday November 06 2003, @10:05AM
  • I was lucky enough to be in the basement.. at the aftershow party for the first RAH gig.. and got Morrissy's autograph.. I am sure we were being filmed by the unnobtrusive caemra crew.. Ohh.. how I'd like to see that few minutes of footgae.. is there someone i can ask to check the stuff lying on the cutting room floor?

    Ruffian <[email protected]> -- Thursday November 06 2003, @10:01AM (#78810)
    (User #1813 Info)
    "In the days when you were hopelessly poor, I just liked you more..."
  • On of the best things about Morrissey is that in his writing he isn't afraid to talk about completely natural feelings everyone has for both genders. Love for Morrissey is not about bodies interlocking in some animal mating, but an emotional connection between two souls. What we love about people is not what genitalia they have but what they have inside, so it is natural to love men and women. But if anyone saw the documentary, you'll remember Morrissey saying He is not a sexual person. He says he was celibate until he was in his twenties because he just does not like sex and doesn't believe sex is for everyone. He says he does have sex now but the documentary showed him on the pull with lots of fine young ladies. I think though he obviously has a natural desire for other men, I doubt he's actually acted on it because of his Catholic upbringing. He dislikes sex which is clearly related to the religion he was raised in.
    Stefo -- Thursday November 06 2003, @10:48AM (#78817)
    (User #9392 Info)
  • You seem to have forgotten the sequences of the documentary where Morrissey speaks out loud for asexuality and at the end of the film he is saying he can't imagine that people get along in a relationship!
    Anonymous -- Thursday November 06 2003, @10:52AM (#78819)
  • be amiguous about their sexuality.
    because they don't have to.
    Anonymous -- Thursday November 06 2003, @04:14PM (#78863)
  • Using the word "indictment makes it sound like being gay is some sort of crime. I could care less if a great songwriter is gay or straight--unless of course they practically provide a soundtrack for your younger years, growing up gay. Those early Smiths songs were astonishingly accurate about what it's like being gay and struggling with it. I don't expect straight people to be able to "get it"--you're so used to the whole world revolving around you and your unnatural desires--but smart gay people will see the truth like a frikkin neon billboard.

    People who think Morrissey is straight are in serious denial. Would you like some cream with that coffee?
    BobC -- Thursday November 06 2003, @07:09PM (#78885)
    (User #5785 Info)
  • This is getting SO OLD. Who cares which way he sways, none of us are ever going to have him, so it doesn't matter and analyzing the lyrics won't get us anywhere either. We can put our own meaning into each and every song and we'd have a point and not all the songs are autobiographical. The truth is, this is none of our business and the topic is played out. Whatever he prefers, lets hope he's happy and at peace with himself and his life. Everyone deserves that and that's all I wish for him. I can understand why he wouldn't want a documentary about his career be all about his sexuality, after 20 years a documentary and all they want to talk about is his sexuality that is so stupid.
    Anonymous -- Thursday November 06 2003, @11:01PM (#78891)
  • I was one of his lover...
    Anonymous -- Friday November 07 2003, @03:24AM (#78905)
  • I'll tell you why it's "important." Because no one before Morrissey ever, EVER, had the balls to speak openly and honestly about what being gay is really like. Here was a man talking about a flirtation with an older man ("This Charming Man")--I just never heard that before in my Guns n' Roses collection! Then there was "How Soon is Now" talking about A club where "you can meet someone who'll love you." The straight people on this thread who are so uncomfortable discussing this issue ("Played out" my ass--you just want us to slam the closet door shut again and I'm not going for it) have no clue that whereas they can meet an opposite sex partner anywhere, WE have to go to gay bars. Our options, at least in the 80's, for meeting people amounted basically to one: going to "the club."

    It's little things like this that fly straight over the heads of straight people but gay people know the deal. Straight bands don't write homages to a flirtation to an older man, in fact they don't want to talk about gay people at all--Just like so many straight people on this board. It gets so annoying constantly being told I can't talk about this. I could give a damn about Morrissey and his sex life but what I DO care about is that he wrote beautiful songs about that subject. Nobody did it before him, and certainly nobody has since. And who the hell is saying ALL the songs were about being gay? Of course not! Who the hell wants to hear only that? Life is broad and fascinating and he says it all! But you can't ignore the blatant references to homosexuality.
    BobC -- Friday November 07 2003, @08:37AM (#78917)
    (User #5785 Info)
  • One thing we can be sure of, is that Morrissey likes men. Whether or not he likes woman is really what's up for debate.

    Personally, I think he's tried to like women in his past, but they certainly aren't his preference.

    Either he's gay or bi-sexual. Deal with it. Anyone who says otherwise is deep in denial.
    Anonymous -- Friday November 07 2003, @09:16AM (#78918)
  • I will say this again I'm convinced Morrissey is neither gay nor straight. He's not a sexual person. He's said that! Morrissey's greatness is in acknowledging that people aren't gay or straight, only human. He tears down the walls that lock in heterosexuals and homosexuals.I acknowledges it's fine to love and not have sex!
    Stefo -- Friday November 07 2003, @11:12AM (#78945)
    (User #9392 Info)
  • Is Morrissey the biggest homo in town as Simpson said,or only a person frustrated in his attempts to having affective and sexual relationships with human beings?
    Anonymous -- Saturday November 08 2003, @09:45AM (#79058)
  • A couple of years ago some friends of mine in a band encountered Morrissey in LA. They spent a few days in his company. All agreed he was a jolly nice chap to go to the pub with.
    However, their recollections differed regarding his sexuality. One friend became convinced Morrissey was 'coming on' to him all the time, whilst another believed Morrissey was dating the woman he always came to into and left the bar with.
      Maybe my friend was just paranoid, maybe the woman was his PA, who knows and who cares. The point is these people had actually met and spent time with Morrissey, [none of them are fans, so would have no reason to lie about it], and none of them could make up there mind about his sexual orientation. I have always suspected Morrissey to be bi-sexual [lyrical clue'I Can Have Both' for instance] and like Montgomery Clift, Oscar Wilde etc is becoming more homosexually inclined the older he becomes. I suggest doubters read some of his earlier interviews [The Face 1984, Melody maker 1986 to name a couple and another I can't recall with Johnny Marr claiming Morrissey had had lots of girl and boyfriends in the past but was at that point celibate]. Whatever Morrissey is, he does not wish to make it available for public consumption. Everyone naturally hopes that the person they admire is orientated in the same direction as themselves, but this is not always the case. I am unaware of any grand gentleman's agreement in the media regarding Morrissey's sexuality, so one would imagine if there is anything out there it would have come to light by now. Although Morrissey, like a [dwindling] number of other celebrities does not court the tabloid gossip obssessed press, so they do not report anything about him.
    But in the end does it really matter whether he is waiting for his mother to pass away before coming out or whatever, people would still be unhappy. If he married, it would be a marriage of convenience in some eyes. Let us not forget Morrissey's image has had 20 years of shrewd cultivation. As someone noted earlier, his themes of alienation and perpetual outsider image would no longer have any relevance if he slotted himself into a hetero/homo or even bi-sexual landscape. This way he can indeed have both [or indeed all three] and no-one feels left out. But in the same way it keeps the interest alive, certainly for journalists, who might hope they one day will get the big scoop should he ever decide to go on record.
      You never know the truth could surprise everyone. Very few celebrities mirror what their public persona reflects. He could actually be celibate, they do exist,but I suspect everyone would find that rather dull. Remember, when the legend becomes fact, print the legend.
    Anonymous -- Sunday November 09 2003, @06:24AM (#79097)
  • Whilst Morrissey appears to have no visible ex-girlfriends, he also has no bona fide ex-boyfriends. Jake and a few others have been touted as such, but show us the proof. Could any ex-lovers of Steven Patrick Morrissey, be they male, female, animal or vegetable please stand up and phone your nearest tabloid scandal sheet and put this whole tiresome issue to bed once and for all.
    Anonymous -- Sunday November 09 2003, @06:57AM (#79100)

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